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MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise

We are testing two new 16-inch MacBook's before doing a rollout across our organization. Under low loads (25% cpu utilization), fan noise will get annoyingly loud. We're not doing any GPU related and more routine work such as: using web applications, debugging web pages, Microsoft Teams conferencing (audio/video) with a handful of people, Photos downloading from iCloud, Mac Mail downloading a new mailbox from Exchange.


We DID NOT notice this on our 2015 MacBooks and this might prevent us from continuing the 16-inch MacBook rollout in our organization.


Interested to hear others experiences.


Tim

MacBook Pro 16", macOS 10.15

Posted on Nov 21, 2019 11:34 AM

Reply
4,224 replies

Dec 27, 2019 10:22 AM in response to TimUzzanti

Technical content of what you post are not evaluated when you post here. Your posts here are audited by a team that ONLY ensures compliance with the Terms of Use, and Removal is based on compliance with the Terms of Use, and nothing more.


Apple employs thousands of people worldwide. Reaching the ear Engineering Movers and Shakers by posting here is extremely unlikely. Your Business Support people are far more likely to get the ear of Engineering. Readers here are other Users like you. If other Readers can not provide suggestions that lead to a solution, you need to contact Apple directly using other methods.


Dec 27, 2019 10:46 AM in response to kurtzenter

We have tested four different computers and based on how low the CPU / GPU utilization is before the heat gets out of control, this may be unsolvable without Apple under-clocking the GPU or artificially reducing the performance of the machine. That would be VERY bad for Apple. The Apple Business Team seems more than willing to take back the machines but we were more interested in solving the problem and not returning them.

Dec 27, 2019 11:01 AM in response to TimUzzanti

Engineering Movers and Shakers do not generally read what you post here. There are no formal procedures for escalating problems from here.


However, when senior contributors feel a situation is becoming a reasonably clear and urgent trend, we can produce a summary of the situation and cite pertinent forum postings, and ask Community Moderators to intervene. On a case-by-case basis, they may decide to notify their informal contacts in various department with a "heads up" to read a group of discussions that may provide insights on a particular issue Users are experiencing. There is also the extremely slim possibility (but again no formal procedure) that Engineers could read your postings and decide there was a problem. and contact you for more information.


If you were contacted by someone from Apple, it is likely to be a solely information-gathering interaction, outside of normal problem resolution methods. This sort of contact will not likely lead to more contact or follow-up for YOUR specific problem.


You can not and should not rely on this informal and infrequent contact to get your problem resolved. Best results are obtained from being as selfish as possible, and pressing through as many channels as possible to get your own problem resolved.


As a side effect, it may eventually get solved for others as well.

Dec 27, 2019 10:56 AM in response to Grant Bennet-Alder

I am not sure if you noticed, but the original poster (and others) have been already in lengthy discussion with Apple representatives, and it seems like their case isn't responded to any more.


Anyway, it is sad to see such issue and to be honest, if it is not a software issue that can be solved with a firmware upgrade through an OS update patch, it is unlikely to be solved any soon.


I am personally waiting for the replacement to arrive (will be the third machine I try) to try it out and my hopes are totally down. If it is true and the issue persisted on the third machine, like many others, I will return it and stick with my 2017 model till new model release to see if it is any better

Dec 28, 2019 6:35 AM in response to TimUzzanti

Wanted to share something interesting I've found on youtube. While researching alternatives to MBP16" I've come across this video of Razer Blade 15 (9750H, same CPU, but paried with GTX1660Ti instead of Radeon) interacting with an external monitor.


It looks (and sounds) like exactly the same issue, see for yourself: https://youtu.be/IRViiPj5cDM


I guess it just proves that we're at the very limits of thermal performance for laptop chassis, until Intel (or AMD) get their act together.

Dec 28, 2019 6:54 AM in response to Ahmed Ali Awad

Both Blade and base MBP16 have similar specs (6core Intel + comparable GPUs) and a similar cooling solution (dual fans fed by heatpipes), and, unfortunately, I don't think you can affect thermodynamics with US dollars or Apple's infamous reality distortion field.


Jokes and pricepoints aside, I wish designers would just make laptops thicker to allow for a better cooling solution. This 16" incher is already not that portable, adding a bit of thickness would not be the end of the world.

Dec 28, 2019 6:52 AM in response to HaydenMk2

i have to wait now 2-3 week for a new MacBook. Lets see. may my Mac is a faulty one.


I also ordered an external eGPU from Apple. May it will help a little bit. I use mainly Logic and ProTools.

I also found out, that my Macbook is running a little bit cooler (around 3-5%), when I do not plug in the Powercable direct to the Mac. I put before an hub, that gets real hot but it works a little bit.


ill keep you all informed.



sorry for my English

Dec 28, 2019 7:27 AM in response to HaydenMk2

I do understand that the heat of the process isn’t solvable just because of a more pricy machine; but I do understand that a higher price sets pr for acceptance criteria; and if the heat isn’t solvable, the noise level should be; I am not hardware engineer myself; but I am talking from a consumer point of view, there is no point of paying extra $ if I am not getting anything creatively better

Dec 30, 2019 1:09 AM in response to Ahmed Ali Awad

Ahmed Ali Awad wrote:

I do understand that the heat of the process isn’t solvable just because of a more pricy machine; but I do understand that a higher price sets pr for acceptance criteria; and if the heat isn’t solvable, the noise level should be; I am not hardware engineer myself; but I am talking from a consumer point of view, there is no point of paying extra $ if I am not getting anything creatively better


A faster processor will generate more heat, which results in higher fan speeds.


You are paying extra money to get that extra performance (and, unfortunately, extra heat that results.)

Dec 30, 2019 2:58 AM in response to Grant Bennet-Alder

Assuming that quieter fans (fans that spin fast with less noise) aren't possible, it still annoying to have constant noise even in ideal mode; I don't need the CPU power to be consistently in use even if I don't need it and cause unwanted noise.

Do you think it is acceptable to have noise when your CPU is under 10% utilisation? like the majority of the time?

At this moment, I can't tell when a process is causing a heavy load on my machine, or it is just the noisy fan that is messing around without checking my activity monitor

Dec 30, 2019 7:54 AM in response to Dogcow-Moof

Have you read anything in this thread William?


Apple Engineers did communicate with some of us via this forum but they went MIA after getting the information they needed from us.  Not only do we have the hardware issues, we now get no updates after working with Apple Support Engineers.


Maybe you are not familiar with Apple's level of Business support?  Apple is a consumer company and structured as such.  Working with Apple from a Business standpoint sometimes feels like you are a glorified consumer.  Each Apple Store has a few Business team members.  Apple Business team members don't have direct phone numbers or emails, you work with them via a "group" email address.  In many of the stores, you will be lucky to have a Business team member stay for more than a year... it's a transient position.  


In my post that was deleted, it stated a number of roadblocks we have had working with Apple.  These aren't subjective and they are all relative to this thread.  When you have issues, do you look at all channels to get help to resolve your problems?  That is why I started this thread, to discuss the hardware problem and work with others.


I own a software development company and previously owned one of the largest Windows Hosting companies in the world.  I have always had communities and still have communities for my customers to communicate with each other.  I don't appreciate it when customers complain in our communites, but that wasn't what I was doing or what has been happening here.  We have been doing everything we can to share our technical experiences with each other and with Apple.  


When some of that broke down, we have shared our experiences in the past and also our frustrations because we have attempted many ways to workaround software, hardware, or arbitrary limitations that Apple has put in place.


It would be appreciated that you not mute our voices or the conversation when all we are trying to do is to find a way to continue using Apple in our lives (as a Consumer or as a Business).


Thanks,


Tim


[Edited by Moderator]

Dec 30, 2019 6:18 AM in response to TimUzzanti

Same here :)


I'm happy because was able to return the machine already.

I appreciate the silent work environment, which was not possible with this laptop.

The fans on the new MBP16 are insane, the loudest noise I have ever experienced with any MBP (since 2009).

And I talking here about normal workflow (NOT "too much stuff running" like some people suggesting).


Tested the machine with two 4k monitors (BenQ PD3220U & ASUS ProArt PA32UCX-K), there is no chance to do some work on this setup, there is no lag at all (performance-wise is great, the best MacBook Pro ever), but the whole acoustic experience is similar to Airbus A380 starting procedure (the fans are loud as ....). Just can't imagine how the MBP16 can handle 6k Pro Display XDR, or even two of them (as advertised).


I love Apple, I really do. Just IMHO, the MBP16 is not suitable for professionals, who appreciate a pleasant work environment.

This leaves me with only a few Mac alternatives, which are unfortunately more expensive.


XOXO

Dec 30, 2019 6:36 AM in response to Dogcow-Moof

William,


Do you not expect Apple to manage the heat for whatever hardware combinations they provide like every other hardware manufacturer does? I really don't understand why you would just say "faster processor means more heat".


Not only do we see excessive fan noise at very low CPU usage, we also see CPU throttling slightly above that. As I posted numerous times, we eliminate the GPU by using an eGPU and see much better results.


Apple had a similar issues with the 2018 MacBook Pro and the i9 processor. This issue was directly related to the processor but in the 16 inch MacBook, it seems to be more related to the GPU.


Thanks,


Tim

MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise

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