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External camera laggy - low frame rate

I've just upgraded from a 2018 MacBook Pro to the MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2020, Four Thunderbolt 3 ports).

When using the Mac's FaceTime camera, everything works fine. However, when connecting it to my LG UltraFine 5K (as I was my previous Mac), the camera feed is laggy (in every application).


The frame rate is really low and erratic - ranging from one frame per second to even fewer.


My previous Mac worked fine with the same monitor.


I've tried:

Using a different Thunderbolt port on the Mac to connect to the display.

Resetting the Mac's PRAM and SMC.

Creating and testing with a new user.

Reinstalling 10.15.4.

Checking for firmware updates for the external display.


all to no avail.


I can't seem to fix the issue, nor can I find any suitable help online.


Any thoughts are appreciated.



Posted on May 19, 2020 8:46 AM

Reply
Question marked as Top-ranking reply

Posted on Jun 18, 2020 11:05 AM

I did a bunch of debugging as I have the same issue, and annoyingly the upload of some images failed and the post was lost.


Anyway, after I hit submit I did some more digging and found the culprit, which wasn't in the original post.


The yellow errors are thrown when I changed cameras in Photo Booth from either my Logitech C920 (connected to the USB ports on the back of the display) or the laptop's Facetime camera to the LG 5K display's camera.



The repeating pairs of


DECODING ERROR -12904
RETURN ERROR -12904


tell us that the


decompressionOutputHandler


method on line 3374 in the


CMIO_Unit_Convertor_VideoToolboxDecompressor


C++ class is receiving an errant response that it can't decode, likely frame data which needs to evaluate to a set of numbers of particular format which constitute a valid basis for conversion by the decompressor into a frame as displayed by the output application (Photo Booth in my test case).


Unfortunately, that source file is part of the CoreMedia framework itself and is thus closed source, so I can't actually see exactly what it's doing, but I'm pretty certain the scenario outlined above is the likely case.


So now we know part of the what that is causing the symptoms, but we still don't have a root cause for what is causing that nor the why it is happening on this model only.


On that, I'm guessing that the Intel graphics hardware this model contains, the Intel Iris Plus, Device ID: 0x8a53 and Revision ID: 0x0007 (which perhaps the current 16" has as well, though both models there would likely hand off to the AMD GPU thus masking this bug) is generating some data which results in an array (which represents the numeric data set that a video frame is encapsulated in) boundary being overstepped so only 1 in several fall into line with the expected format (apologies to anyone on this thread who isn't a software developer, this is about as high level as I can make it; but think of a clock which needs to show 12 o'clock every time you look at at it, but each time you look away it increments the time by 1 hour; you only get a valid response once every 12 attempts), resulting in a large volume of dropped frames and juddering output.


Sadly, the only way I can test that out is with an eGPU for the OS to delegate the graphics offload to with a suitable application (I checked and it doesn't look like Photo Booth would do this, but I think zoom does if a real GPU is available).


So who needs to fix this? Well, that's tricky because I haven't conclusively proven what is at fault, but my first port of call would be Apple, to patch that method to handle the returned data that can't currently be processed, effectively fixing the broken array by reindexing it before returning the value (assuming my hypothesis above is correct).


I'll add my findings to the chorus with a bug ticket.

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213 replies
Question marked as Top-ranking reply

Jun 18, 2020 11:05 AM in response to magicmarc

I did a bunch of debugging as I have the same issue, and annoyingly the upload of some images failed and the post was lost.


Anyway, after I hit submit I did some more digging and found the culprit, which wasn't in the original post.


The yellow errors are thrown when I changed cameras in Photo Booth from either my Logitech C920 (connected to the USB ports on the back of the display) or the laptop's Facetime camera to the LG 5K display's camera.



The repeating pairs of


DECODING ERROR -12904
RETURN ERROR -12904


tell us that the


decompressionOutputHandler


method on line 3374 in the


CMIO_Unit_Convertor_VideoToolboxDecompressor


C++ class is receiving an errant response that it can't decode, likely frame data which needs to evaluate to a set of numbers of particular format which constitute a valid basis for conversion by the decompressor into a frame as displayed by the output application (Photo Booth in my test case).


Unfortunately, that source file is part of the CoreMedia framework itself and is thus closed source, so I can't actually see exactly what it's doing, but I'm pretty certain the scenario outlined above is the likely case.


So now we know part of the what that is causing the symptoms, but we still don't have a root cause for what is causing that nor the why it is happening on this model only.


On that, I'm guessing that the Intel graphics hardware this model contains, the Intel Iris Plus, Device ID: 0x8a53 and Revision ID: 0x0007 (which perhaps the current 16" has as well, though both models there would likely hand off to the AMD GPU thus masking this bug) is generating some data which results in an array (which represents the numeric data set that a video frame is encapsulated in) boundary being overstepped so only 1 in several fall into line with the expected format (apologies to anyone on this thread who isn't a software developer, this is about as high level as I can make it; but think of a clock which needs to show 12 o'clock every time you look at at it, but each time you look away it increments the time by 1 hour; you only get a valid response once every 12 attempts), resulting in a large volume of dropped frames and juddering output.


Sadly, the only way I can test that out is with an eGPU for the OS to delegate the graphics offload to with a suitable application (I checked and it doesn't look like Photo Booth would do this, but I think zoom does if a real GPU is available).


So who needs to fix this? Well, that's tricky because I haven't conclusively proven what is at fault, but my first port of call would be Apple, to patch that method to handle the returned data that can't currently be processed, effectively fixing the broken array by reindexing it before returning the value (assuming my hypothesis above is correct).


I'll add my findings to the chorus with a bug ticket.

May 20, 2020 7:49 PM in response to magicmarc

magicmarc Said:

"Definitely sounds like the same issue. What do we do now, I wonder. Perhaps I should contact Apple. I hope it’s a software fix and not a hardware issue. It’s fairly frustrating, especially in a time like this!"

-------


Report this to Apple as a Bug:

Apple wont get back to you directly, but the more they know of this, the more they will know what is going on, and what needs to be fixed. To report it...

  1. Go Here: Feedback - MacBook Pro - Apple
  2. Select: "Bug Report" for the "Feedback Type"
  3. Select:
  4. Proceed from there as necessary.

May 27, 2020 8:05 PM in response to dkaib1

dkaib1 Said:

Having the exact same issue. With my old 2016 MBP 13-inch, Two Thunderbolt ports, the Ultrafine 5k's camera works flawlessly. With the new 2020 MBP, Four Thunderbolt ports, the camera is nearly unusable most of the time, with one frame per ~5 seconds.

———-


Why Risk a Faulty Device?:

With this being a frequent occurrence, I would strongly recommend you send this in to Apple for device support. You have a one-year out-of-the-box warranty. So, most certainly have Apple look into this device.

———-


Perform the following in the order provided:


I. Request Send-In Service:

The only option, as of this post, would be to contact Apple, and have it sent it for service/replacement.

  1. Apple: would send you a box
  2. You: send it to Apple
  3. Apple: would fix it or replace it
  4. You: would receive it back from Apple

---


II. Contacting Apple Support:

A. Phone Support Info:


B. Chat Session Info:

Being that phone calls are taking a moment, perform a chat session with Apple Support.

Setting Up the Cbat Session:

  1. Go to: support.apple.com
  2. Scroll Down to "Tell us how we can help"
  3. Select: Get Support
  4. Proceed from there as Necessay

Aug 27, 2020 9:50 AM in response to magicmarc

magicmarc Said:

"External camera laggy - low frame rate: [...]Reinstalling 10.15.4.[...]"

-------


The Update is the Culprit:

You made this change to your Mac. So, it has to do with this, all the way.


So, what to do:


Restore to a Time Machine Backup:

Any Time Machine Backups made prior to this update installation? If so, restore to one.


To Fix it, Perform a Downgrade:

  1. First, create a Time Machine Backup (TMB) of your current Mac.
  2. Once created, transfer it over from your backup.

Learn More Here: How to move your content to a new Mac


In Depth:

1. Back up your Mac:

Create a Time Machine backup of your Mac, so that you can have something to restore your Mac from, should anything go wrong with the transfer.


2. Migrate and Reinstall Data and Apps:

Next migrate it over from the Time Machine Backup you created in Step 1 to this 2019 Mac. Some of your apps may not work with macOS Catalina or Mojave, if they are not64-bit. If something does not run in the new install, request from the developers new keys for the software. Inform them that your Mac has crashed, and that they give you the installation files you need (Ask for 64-bit installers).

May 20, 2020 1:32 PM in response to dhowell626

I'm not entirely sure, but I installed this LG Screen Manager, and it oddly made a new folder in my Downloads folder called 27MD5KB which is one of the model numbers. I presume it's mine..!


According to this, the latest model number is 27MD5KL, and mine's the penultimate.


How odd. The only thing I've changed recently was my MacBook Pro - my previous one (2018 model) had no issues with the camera at all.


Did you have a previous Mac and find the same by any chance?

Jul 16, 2020 9:22 AM in response to danpalmer

In case it's getting drowned out in the ever increasing thread length, I identified the problem (or at least, a likely candidate for it) back in this post:


https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251375319?answerId=252878780022#252878780022


Please quote Feedback Assistant case reference FB7743077 in any of your correspondence with Apple; so far there are no related cases linked to it.

Aug 27, 2020 9:49 AM in response to bkorth

magicmarc Said:

"External camera laggy: all to no avail. I can't seem to fix the issue, nor can I find any suitable help online. Any thoughts are appreciated."

-------


In the Longrun, Learn from this:

If you never made a Time Machine Backup before this update, then learn from this. Know to always. back up your mac, piroshki's to updating it. Create a Time Machine backup of your Mac, so that you can have something to restore your Mac from, should anything go wrong with the update.

Aug 28, 2020 5:11 PM in response to anord1

There are two different versions off the monitors.


For example, the 5K version includes at least two different models:

- 27MD5KA - This is a Thunderbolt only model

- 27MD5KB - This is the newer model that supports USB-C as well.


For example, only the newer model supports the iPad Pro.

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT210205


My issues are with the older model. Is that the case with others as well?

Nov 9, 2020 2:07 PM in response to magicmarc

Reply I have this question too (112)

Hi there,


We're having the exact same issue. Hardware:

  • LG UltraFine 5K
  • 2020 MacBook Pro 13-inch Catalina 10.15.7
    • 4-port, 10th-gen i5 2GHz, 16 GB RAM
    • Intel Iris Plus Graphics

The video lag using the monitor's camera occurs in MS Teams and FaceTime. We have done all suggested Apple troubleshooting (with Apple Support) like going through the SMC reset, reinstalling the OS, trying it on another user account. Does anyone have any suggestions? Would a different system (Mac with different specs) resolve this? What about the I/O and how the systems are connected, any advice?

Nov 9, 2020 2:29 PM in response to AnonymouslyObvious

At this point, based on my testing, I think you have two choices:

  1. Downgrade you MBP to 2019 or earlier.
  2. Upgrade your LG 5k Ultrafine to the latest >hardware< version... 27MD5KL-B.

Yes, both are big purchases. That neither Apple or LG have addresses or even acknowledged this is truly frustrating.

Worse, having you spend all that time troubleshooting a known issue is inexcusably poor customer service and operationally inefficient.

Aug 30, 2020 3:44 AM in response to pssmith80

OK, some more data points to add.


Yesterday I picked up a Blackmagic eGPU (for other reasons, but this was nonetheless part of the decision to get one).


Unfortunately the issue persists even with a dedicated GPU. Anecdotally, Photo Booth, which is GPU optimised seems to be better - though still not great - despite throwing the same volume of errors as when run without a dedicated GPU. If this perception is accurate it's probably down to the pace at which the GPU can error out and move onto rendering the next frame.



QuickTime Player performance was still terrible, as (surprisingly, to me at least) it does not appear to be GPU optimised and so used the Intel iGPU only.



Zoom, sadly, despite being optimised to use the GPU as required, was still pretty unusable.


May 20, 2020 6:34 AM in response to magicmarc

Thanks to the OP for taking the time to do all that troubleshooting! I'm having the same issue, and I'm glad to not have to go through all that 😉


I'll also note that I'm seeing the same issue in a variety of programs that use the camera; Zoom, FaceTime, Hand Mirror, Slack, Google Meet. All the same, extremely low framerate and really laggy. Completely unusable.

External camera laggy - low frame rate

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