Problem with finding Voice Memos on my computer

In the old days, when there was still iTunes, I could open voice memos I made with my iPhone in iTunes on my Mac computer.

Now iTunes has gone, and I have problems finding my voices memos back on both my MacBook Air and my Mac mini M1.

When I open Voice memos on the computers, I only see recordings I made after June, 2018. The older ones — they are still in my iPhone — are nowhere to be found

Syncing does not work really great. E.g., I still do not see two recordings with the iPhone I made just the other day.

So, can someone please tell me:

Where on my MacBook or on the Mini do I find back the old memos I made back in the iTunes days?

If they are not there, is there a way to upload them from my iPhone to the computer? Or to iCloud, for that matter?

Thanks a lot!