Time Machine backups taking long, after macOS Sonoma update on my MacBook.

Ever since I upgraded my M1 Macbook Pro from the immediately previous Mac OS version to Sonoma, I have had nothing but problems using Time Machine to perform backups on an external SSD. No issues at all prior to Sonoma doing incremental backups for about one year - took about 20 minutes per incremental backup. My first backup attempt using Sonoma, I gave up after 3-1/2 hours when Time Machine reported 3 hours still remaining. Tried a second time while Time Machine had been running for some time and while on the phone Apple Support , gave up after 2-1/2 hours. I had other tasks to attend to. On a third attempt at Apple Support's recommendation, I let it run to see if it would error off. It did not error off, but this time it took about 3-1/2 hours for an incremental backup. Apple Support gave me a follow up call after the last backup completed at 3+ hours. They requested that I reinstall Sonoma and run Time Machine again and report back. Spoke with Apple Support after the reinstall of Sonoma and Time Machine backup completed. Time Machine backup completed in about one hour. Apple Support then requested that I initiate a new incremental backup while on the phone with them - an absolute disaster followed. I shared that Time Machine was reporting over 17,000 changes after about 30 minutes of idle time, with no activity, no browsing, no nothing , just sitting idle while charging. While on the phone with Apple Support again, Time Machine reported an estimated backup time of 10 hours! Terminated the backup and communicated such to Apple Support. As a software PM, there is no doubt in my mind that there is a significant flaw in Apple's Mac OS Sonoma and the Time Machine app. It bothers me that I have also wasted many hours over several days trying to resolve this issue. I have zero confidence that my Time Machine backups are correct and usable.


[Re-Titled by Moderator]

MacBook Pro (M1, 2020)

Posted on Oct 1, 2023 7:44 PM

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Question marked as Top-ranking reply

Posted on Nov 6, 2023 6:40 AM

I have the same problem. Both on a Mini M1 and a MacBook 14 Pro M1 Pro.


Backups worked perfectly on Ventura BEFORE upgrade and instal of Sonoma 14.1.


Both make Time Machine backups each hour. To local external disk, and to a networked share.


Backups are 2TB (max size) for the M1 (HDD and network) and 4TB (max size) for the Macbook 14 Pro (SSD and network). In total a maximum of 12TB. All are encrypted.


None of the backup targets are full., but they contain recent history (document versions, code versions etc), that I do not want to loose.


In energy saving, I have specifically set "Don't go to sleep, when screen is closed", and 5 seconds after screen closes, password or fingerprint is required. The M1 has an Apple keyboard with fingerprint reader. Works.


There have NEVER been problems with this setup BEFORE Sonoma 14.1


AFTER, I periodically get the error message: "The file “BackupDisk” couldn’t be opened because you don’t have permission to view it." I have some choice words for that statement.


I can reproduce the following:


If I work on the machines: No problems. TimeMachine will do, what it has to do. So accessing the local drives or remote networked backups is no problem. Credentials work. Data is correct. Time Machine can access ALL four backup targets without problem. I have permission. Unrestricted and any time, the computer screen does not go to sleep.


Whether the backup takes minutes or hours. NO DIFFERENCE.


If I decide, that I do NOT want to sit by the computer for hours on end, just to make TimeMachine Backups possible, and leave the machine to continue on it's own, the screen will of course go to sleep (no pause screen). The display (internal or external) turns off after the specified timeout of 30 minutes (on external power). Works.


I have NOT tested in battery mode, YET, but assume that if you use shorter display timeout in battery mode, you'll experience the problem far, far more often.


The problem seems to exclusively being triggered, byt the display turning off (probably with a five second grace period). When I activate the keyboard, and log in (fingerprint), the TimeMachine backup has stopped, with a red exclamation mark, and the above error.


There are NO credential problems, before the screen goes to sleep (which is standard) and requires a password for login (which is standard basic security procedure). After 30 minutes inactivity and 5 seconds grace time.


Now if I login again, and restart the backup, there are NO problems. And as long as I produce periodic keyboard input - or other activity - on the mashine performing the backup, NO PROBLEMS EXIST, and the backup completes.


As I see it, there's a bug in TimeMachine or Sonoma 14.1's handling credentials for access to encrypted backups (on network or local media), while the displays is off, and the requirement for renewed user login is activated after a five seconds grace period (in my case).


TimeMachine has ALL the credentials it has always needed. TimeMachine can access all backups (remote or local) reliably and consistently, as long as the display is on.


A clear bug. One hundred percent reproducible.


After login, just force Time Machine to backup immediately. It will start the backup without problem. I have all the credentials required. For as long as it is needed, as long as my display does NOT turn off dure to inactivity.


The problem could probably be solved quickly, if Apple released a script, that could be run in terminal, and convinced Sonoma, that the credentials used by TimeMachine are completely kosher.


Or immediately release a security update removing the problem.


In my case, the problem can be reproduced.


In my case the problem does not exist, while doing backups, NOT lasting longer than display inactivity timeout.


In my case the problem does not exist, if the inactivity timeout is not triggered (and the need for password entry/fingerprint turns up).


Please check, if the "activity solution" also solves your problem, BEFORE tampering with backups, that may be perfectly good.


Sigh... 

56 replies

Oct 27, 2023 1:07 AM in response to rasmaxwell

Same problem here.

Time machine isn’t backing up incrementally any more but always copies everything from the scratch…

At least the external drives that I have included to back up. Every time hundreds of GB copied again and again.

I had backups back to last February. Now only til yesterday because lack of disc space. xD

This is a serious issue that unfortunately wasn’t resolved in the 14.1 update…

Dec 2, 2023 9:45 AM in response to Olivier-CH

There is no such thing as an incremental Time Machine backup anymore. Full backups can also be painfully slow still fail altogether. Apple was fully aware of backup issues within days of the release of Sonoma. I provided that information to Apple in detail. Here we are months later, and Apple has not fixed the problem. IMO, Apple is slowly walking away from Time Machine while showing disdain for the plight of its users.

Dec 2, 2023 12:23 PM in response to rasmaxwell

OK.


My backups still perform, like before. Huge backups (new video edits) take a long time, small backups (system, texts etc) take a very short time.


All my backups are using the same targets: Encrypted APFS (HDD or SSD or shares on my NAS, that would presumably include at least some overhead costs. The actual speed obtained seems to reflect only target media potential. Give or take.


I feel for you, but I do not experience your specific problem.


I wish I could help, but how?


Regards

Dec 14, 2023 12:24 AM in response to pine man

Not for me.


I was not aware of TM issues with Sonoma. With the release of 14.2 I upgraded my M1 MBP from 13.6. … to be greeted with messages that TM has problems.


  • I can access the drive.
  • But both automatic and manual TM backups cause error messages that "backup could not be completed". So not really informative.
  • Within TM settings a message says that it is "waiting for iCloud documents to sync, which might take days". What?


Never had issues like that before.

Dec 23, 2023 1:31 PM in response to rasmaxwell

FIX for "Time Machine cannot back up because some iCloud Drive files have not yet finished syncing"


There may be other causes for this error from the one experienced. However, in my case, I kept getting this error because I have other user accounts (for which I am an executor of their estate) on my computer that have Apple IDs, but are not properly logged in. As soon as I fully signed out of the Apple ID accounts for those other users, Time Machine started backing up for me.


The lesson learned is that Apple ID credentials for all user accounts on your computer must be up to date. Note just for your own.

Jan 8, 2024 9:01 AM in response to rasmaxwell

I've been backing up using TM to two APFS external drives, one an OWC 2TB non-partitioned USB3 drive, and the other a La Cie 5TB USB-C drive that was divided into volumes. When I upgraded to Sonoma (14.2.1) I got the "backup delayed" message for the La Cie backup but the OWC backups appear to complete normally (though I haven't tested them yet). Also, Carbon Copy failed to clone my HD to one of the La Cie volumes. So, I'm considering initializing the La Cie drive and trying a new TM backup to it. Not sure whether creating volumes is a good idea.

Jan 12, 2024 5:18 AM in response to DirkZ71

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/255171911?answerId=260049135022&sortBy=best#260049135022


Yes, I also consider Time Machine essential, but with decreasing confidence.


I have my doubts that Apple takes Time Machine seriously.


Remember when Time Machine came out, and the storage format for Apple Mail was changed so that it plays well with Time Machine, namely from mbox to emlx. Those were the glorious days for Time Machine.


What has happened since?

  • iCloud is front and center for Apple … but not with Time Machine. (Cloud syncing is not a backup, maybe part of a backup strategy against some data loss scenarios.)
  • APFS was a big deal when it came out, and the feature set screams Time Machine … but the development to use APFS features in TM took how many years?
  • Worst of all: There is no way to TM-way to restore essential user data in Apple apps such as Notes, Reminders, Contacts, Photos, Music.


Regarding the last point: Yes, users may fiddle with the hidden db-files in their Library folder. But the whole point of Time Machine was to make backup and restore easy, even fun.

And even for advanced users it can be difficult to restore the edit state of a note from two days ago, something that is easily possible with a regular document.


The technical reason is clear: These apps store their data not document-centric. But Apple could overcome this in two ways:

  • Just like Mail was changed to emlx, so Apple could have told developers to play nice with Time Machine and use a file per note, contact, etc. in combination with an index for speed.
  • Alternatively Apple could use plug-in for Time Machine like they do for Spotlight, which is also document-centric but plays nice with Notes, Contact, …

Apple has done neither. Even actively developed apps are not built with Time Machine in mind.


Short story:

Many important things that Apple did not do.

Hence I doubt that Apple takes Time Machine seriously. Sad, but Apple's actions speak loudly.


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Time Machine backups taking long, after macOS Sonoma update on my MacBook.

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