DON'T UPDATE TO LION!

To CT:

Why update Java for Lion?
Where did you even get that clue?

<http://support.apple.com/kb/DL1421>

Regarding Lion and WiFi:

I am using a new MB Air with Lion preinstalled. All works fine, including connecting to my own WiFi.

However, when presented with an unprotected WiFi (such as in a coffeeshop), it sees the network but reports a timeout. In the exact same WifI, my ancient PowerBook running 10.4 works flawlessly.

There is also an important exception so far: my MB Air/Lion was able to connect to a city-wide open Wifi where a page shows up in the browser asking me to sign in as a Guest (no p/word, just click on a button).

I suspect that this is some new security feature in Lion. It's certainly no hardware issue and the fact that an older machine/OS works under the same circumstances makes me think it's at least a bug, or possibly a well-intended "feature" gone wrong.

If there is a workaround, I would much appreciate it. FWIW, I was able to turn off IPv4 and connect to the open WiFi with IPv6, but according to Net diagnostics, even though I was connected to the Wifi I was not able to see the network or the internet.

Hence, I advise people interested in buying any portable product running 10.7 to avoid them until the issue is resolved.

I have to agree. I wish I wasn't so much of a fan boy and waited for the .1 release. Out of the 250+ new features that are being touted, I've used one or two and the rest are plain annoying. I miss my Expose and my 4-finger-swipe App Switcher.

On the plus side, the new Safari rocks! It is very fast. It now replaced Chrome as my default browser.

I think that unless you have a pressing reason to upgrade, if there's a feature of Lion that you absolutely need today, just wait a little for the next incremental release, when iCloud goes live.

And to all the "techies" talking about proper ways to install, the whole experience should be EASY. Click on 'buy' in the App Store and magic happens. Anything more than that shouldn't be unnecessary.

Yes, I note that even the MacWorld article I quoted does not actually list third party software specifically.

The Apple article about Java came out on the same day as Lion (20 July). The Flash beta update has been around longer but Adobe didn't even mention Lion on their website until recently and there are no instructions to download the Lion version as such. No wonder Steve Jobs doesn't like Flash.

The codec given in Perian and Flip4Mac are well known to Mac users too, but for new users, these third party apps could be better publicised and that is what this forum is for.

I hope you have a clone of your SL, as all the advice suggests, or did your "leap of faith" preclude even basic good backup practice?

Kudo's to putnik!

And, thanks for explaining!!

Flash 10.7 for LION is a Beta, but it fixed most of my browser issues.

I never would have thought to update Java separately !?

Apple needs to include a very visible list of 3rd party apps and plug-ins that need to be updated.

That's what Release Notes are for and I'm used to reading them.

"Yeah you must be doing something wrong because it couldn't possibly be Apple's fault !

There's a serious amount of fanboy-ism here and on the forums in general, I'm only just beginning to realise how bad it is. Fanboys presume the OP is guilty (the problem) rather than innocent (has found a problem worth investigating). There so much bias that it can't be Apple's fault, it must be the user. Then the OP is usually dismissed with some "humourous" quip ... I use the word humourous generously.

And there's too much equivocation with other popular OSes. Apple is supposed to be head and shoulders above the competition, that's why people spend so much more money on Macs !

If you really like Apple products, like I do, then do the company a favour and question and critique what they do. Undying, unquestioning loyalty will not do the company any favours."

MR DOS;

I agree, some of the replies reak of fanboy-ism and aren't helpful at all but conversly some replies are on the verge of "lion ***** and it will ruin your life" which is probably just as helpful as the fanboy-ism.

My main suggestion to everyone is to keep things logical. If downloading Lion caused your computer to burst into flames, I would say "Don't download Lion" but if you have to download a few more updates to make your system function properly then I would say something like "Read this before downloading Lion" and state your issue.

Overall, this forum is to help people solve problems. Stating the problems you have with your system is great for the forum. It helps people a lot but I just urge everyone to keep things in check. Is Lion going to take your first born? No. Should there be a new holiday celebrating Lion's release? No.

Lion, in my opinion, is a solid platform. I will admit, my computer is a little jumpy and some preferrences are different but my computer is still reliable. I think the next few updates will surely tighten up the program.

If you want something that works 100% and is supported by all your apps, wait. Lion isn't there... YET. But for the average user, Lion offers a ton of new features that are worth the early adoption.

Mac_Cat wrote:

4) My new mouse went crazy. It scroll backwards from what I'm used to. No way to change ti back ! Geeez!

The default scroll direction in Lion is the same as for iOS touch devices: think of it as scrolling the page instead of the view window. Users of both Mac OS & iOS devices generally seem to prefer this but if you don't like it you can change it:

• If you are using a mouse, open the Mouse system preference & uncheck the box at the top for "Move content in the direction of finger movement when scrolling or navigating."

• If you are using a trackpad, open the Trackpad system preference, go to the Scroll & Zoom tab, & uncheck the box for "Scroll direction: natural."

Note: If you are using a non-Apple pointing device that has its own driver & system preference, you may have to change something similar in its preferences. If you don't see such an option or it doesn't work, look for a Lion-compatible update for your device on its maker's web site.

Yes Lion is works perfect for me.

Yes, as a matter of fact I do realize this a forum to help. Not to bash "the poor souls" who's install didn't go as perfectly as yours did. I work in a hospital with hundreds of Macs, developing AD and Group Policy deployment and integration with Medical Devices, as well I've been a developer since 2004 so guess what, I know a little about them, not just fiddling around with them in my spare time. I bet if you run down to the Apple store and buy a brand new MBP with Lion it'll work just fine, but I have about 40 of them in my own environment that were working perfectly before the upgrade and now will not stay connected to WiFi. and I know there many other sites (not home offices or where ever you set up your little Mac Farm) that have the identical problem. You can sit there and try to be superior to everyone and tell them how stupid they are because they didm't get the same results as you did all day and it doesn't change the fact that there is a problem with Lion and nothing has been done about it.

To be fair, I think tonefox was taking issue with the "other million or so people who cannot sustain a WiFi connection with Lion" statement, which is just a wild guess based on a very, very tiny sample of Lion users.

FWIW, we go through this same thing with every new OS version. Some users will have problems, some won't. Some inevitably will post messages blaming the OS for problems that may be caused by something other than the new OS itself, & some of them will make the same silly "fanboy" attacks on users that are just trying to help sort out the facts from the exaggerations that do nothing to solve anybody's problems, whatever the cause.

Well said

NOW you tell me!!!

If you check the other Mac OS forums here, you will find exactly the same kind of "DON'T UPGRADE" warnings (complete with dramatic, all caps titles) for every one of them. You will see the same kinds of problems mentioned, the same arguments & accusations, the same exaggerations & histrionics.

Some of the problems really are caused by some bug in the OS itself. But most turn out to have other causes, usually something that users can diagnose & fix themselves, often with the help of other users.

But whatever the cause, the only thing that we can do here to help solve any of them is plod through all the posts, looking for the ones that provide enough details to know exactly what problem someone is talking about, who it affects, & why that might be so.

For this purpose, the rest of it is just noise. When the noise level gets too high, you can verify that something else happens in all the Mac OS forums: the users other users credit with helping them the most quit posting to the "noisy" topics.

Just something to consider….

I agree, this Lion is a cute PC/iPad hybrid which is quirky and buggy. But, I'm sure all or most of this mess will be worked out. Apple cannot ignor legions of disgruntled end users. So far it's a nightmare for some of us who want get some work done. Elsewhere there are suggestions to put Snow Leopard on a partition on your hard disk. Then you can use both which I think is a good idea until Lion is fixed or has enough hacks to tweak it to your liking.

Apple doesn't need to make a list of anything.

Take a look at Windows, Linux, etc.

The OS developer does not put out a list of applications that need to be updated to work with the new OS. It is the responsibility of the 3rd party software developers to let their users know that an update is needed for the app to function with the new OS.

Do you have any clue how many pieces of software the OS developer (Apple, MS, etc) would have to test to put out a list of compatible and incompatible applications? it would take YEARS to test it all.