Java and Ipad

...

To be clear, I am not even a little confused thank you, Ikrupp.

I did mistype when I said iOS instead of OS, but that's due to typing this on an iPad and it tends to spell what it wants.

What I said was that JAVA is alive and kicking and being updated.

And I still would like the iPad to utilize all the programming languages commonly used.

But this is a thread about Java on the iPad which uses iOS, not OS X or Mountain Lion. Java has never been supported on iDevices and Mr. Jobs made it clear at the start that it never would be.

Given that the recent Java release for ML was to fix yet even more security problems with Java it is not surprising that more versions are being released. It doesn't show it is thriving, it shows it is a security sieve. I turned it off about 50 security holes ago on my Macs while awaiting yet another update and never turned it back on. Hasn't interfered with anything I do.

You all are barking up the wrong tree. My first home computer was a IIe. Since then I have avoided Apple products until I got this expensive toy (iPad 3) for Christmas. The main reason is there are so many things Apple products can't do because if they didn't write it or authorize it (collecting royalties/fees), then it won't exist.

Having been in IT for 30 years, I can't count the number of times a technology was pronounced dead because the vendor can't or won't support it. The fact is, I have already hit a half dozen sites in the last week that use java or flash. I downloaded Photon which solved the flash problem, but one site I subscribe to uses java which makes this a double whammy for loss of value.

Hundreds of websites provide content with these so called obsolete technologies which means millions have been invested in legacy apps that will not be replaced overnight. You can quote your demigod Jobs all you want but all you do is a disservice to your customers. And telling us how you have no issues when we clearly do just reinforces the long known egocentric culture at Apple.

I guess I now have a pricey paperweight that can read mail and play Words with Friends.

What did you do in IT for 30 years?

Given that there are millions of websites, some of which will never be updated, there will always be some outdated technology in use. There are still sites using Real Audio. There are still people using OS2. Still people using the Commodore Amiga. But you aren't going to design a new product and be sure to include compatibility with any of them.

"Hundreds" of websites are a drop in the bucket. Mr. Jobs said at the release of the iPhone it would not use Java since it was outdated technology. There has never been much of a protest over this decision (Flash is a different story). Java is a security nightmare which I'm sure factored into the decision not to support it.

As far as your statement regarding Apple products it is so far off base I won't take the time to individually address it except to say you can even run Windows and Linux on Macs.

Even Adobe has ceased work on mobile Flash. And if your iPad is a paperweight that is because of how you use it. Many other people and industries are using it for work every day including the armed services, airlines, etc. You just make yourself look silly with this type of statement.

I can't help but wonder why when someone simply states their dislike of an apple product's performance, or lack of, it always turns into a personal argument with someone always holding up their jobs marquis and reasserting their belief in the Mac system.

All we're missing here is a "Green" label and then it would be ultimately cool to be a so called Mac.

I came here for help and have received nothing but personal opinions on how outdated the software I need to run on this product is. I didn't choose which software was required, I'm the consumer and I just want the $700 device I bought to do what I was lead to believe it would.

Please save your Mac preaching for your buddies at the coffee shop.

It has been well known that iDevices do not have Java. It was well announced prior to the release of the first iPhone. It was covered in an interview with Mr. Jobs prior to the release who detailed why it would not have Java.

There is no workaround.

Who "lead you to believe" that it would work with Java?

As a veteran consultant you didn't do your research prior to your purchase?

Sell your iPad and buy a tablet that has Java if you need it to do your work.Make sure you reasearch them to be sure it will work before making your purchase.

Problem solved.

I have worked in many aspects of business applications through the years.

I guess I will just be one of the minority that has come to enjoy many 'obsolete' websites that have provided me satisfaction for over a decade. Pogo.com is a major disappointment to lose. Fortunately I still have my laptop which hasn't dictated what I can or cannot access on the Internet.

I do not wish to use my iPad for business purposes. I do enough business computing at work. However, I have worked for agricultural and food industries all my life and we do not have the margins to invest in the development costs for custom creation of apps. It is far more cost effective to have applications that we deploy to desktops, laptops and mobile devices unchanged. And the devices we deploy in plants and the field must be more rugged than an iPad. In fact, the first time I have been anywhere that required support of any Apple product is just recently as our executives are enamored with getting company email on their iPhone.

Lastly, I am not that off base with the Apple culture and marketing approach. Since it is just my opinion vs. yours, I'll leave you with this quote from CBS news from an article about developing your own app.

" Apple keeps about one-third of the price, so you'll get about $2 per sale if your application sells for $2.99."

As I said before, Apple has to either write it or get their cut or it won't exist.

But you said it is just a toy. And apparently that is all you wanted it for, to be a toy.

It isn't my opinion, Mr. Jobs made it very clear why Java would not be on iDevices. If you need Java then you buy one that has Java. To buy an iPad now and expect it to have Java and mobile Flash (which Adobe has dropped) is just illogical.

Apple takes a 30% administrative fee on all apps for the cost of maintaining the servers, the staff to clear the apps and get them on the server, setting up the purchase methods, and keeping an accounting of apps sold, etc. For probably the majority of app writers it would cost them far more to set up all of these administrative services themselves. This was well known and laid out to developers when Apple allowed 3rd party apps (which they originally were not going to do) and their has been no hue and cry about the fee.

You can't run Java, you won't ever be able to, you don't like Apple. So sell your device (you will get a good price for it) and buy an Android Tablet or a Surface.

Java unfortunately isn't supported on the iOS platform. I hope this helps.

I get your point loud and clear and at this point I would love to get a different device. Clearly you don't get the concept of a wife buying a huge Christmas/anniversary present. She would be in tears if I made such a suggestion. And why would I know what decisions the all knowing Jobs made? I have not bought an Apple anything since 1985. Don't bother replying as I won't bother you again unless I have trouble downloading the latest Taylor Swift video. Clearly this is what this product is suited for.

LOL, the Standord football team has their playbooks on iPads. FAA regional managers monitor area flight activity on iPads. And without using Java.

So if you are right-handed and your wife bought you left-handed golf clubs you would keep them?

Really? The quarterback is holding an iPad during his plays? That is impressive! My guys are riding fork lifts 12 hours each shift or riding a detasseler in the field or forgetting their rugged PC in a wash down area in the plant exposed to 12 hours of high pressure water with sterilization chemicals. I guess you got me with dudes on the sideline and people in towers.

And the difference between left and right? You are trying to insult my wife now? How does that compare to all the different technologies out there? She had no reason to know that Apple declined supporting customer's needs.

Are you actually customer support or just some radical Apple fanatic?

Neither.

I can see no reason for iOS not supporting Java except for spite. Android also does not because Google was being sued by Sun (now Oracle). The initial Surface also does not support Java, but the more advanced Surface will.

What is the alternative for developers who'd like to have a platform-agnostic serious application? HTML5 is just too weak for serious applications. Maintaining an 20,000-line JavaScript program would be a complete nightmare -- essentially impossible. Putting all of the work on the server would result in delays for the user that are unacceptable these days.

Java's power is its weakness because such a potent language can have security holes. The Sun (now Oracle) have done a great job of keeping Java up-to-date with new features and with maintaining security. The rumor mill (stimulated no doubt by Apple et al.) keeps throwing mud at Java. Java opened up the Internet for developers and is keeping it open for the serious developer. Go ahead and write your tiny apps and games in HTML5 or write platform-specific apps so that you quadruple your development and maintenance costs. Some have money to burn, I guess. Realize that you're crushing the small but highly professional developer in your rush to kill Java.