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iMessage time stamps messed up

I‘d just like to clarify something about iMessage and know how to fix this problem if it can be fixed. Basically, whenever I’m out and want to send a message to someone who also has an iPhone bed therefore someone who I could send an iMessage to, I still just use the iMessage app to send a text message so I don’t use data as I don’t have much on my allowance. However, as soon as I get back home and get connected to WiFi, the same text message sends as an iMessage, the other person receives the exact same message again, and the time stamp of the message I send changes to the time it sends as an iMessage rather than the time I actually sent it, which means that the reply of the person to my message looks like it was sent before the actual message was, making it all very confusing. Is there any way to fix this or do I just have to live with it?

iPad Pro Wi-Fi, iOS 11.4

Posted on Jul 18, 2018 3:02 AM

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Posted on Jul 21, 2018 9:27 PM

Ok. I get the picture now. The Messages app and iMessage service are doing exactly what they're geared to do in that situation, date/time stamping included. The problem is that you're either getting a false negative submission acknowledgement or no submission acknowledgement at all from the carrier on the original SMS. If it's no submission acknowledgement at all, that could be due to the carrier using a lower level acknowledgement system not supported by iPhone and thus probably not widely supported by smartphones. This could indicate a non-iPhone certified carrier service. Dirty deeds done dirt cheap.


I reiterate that when I temporarily disable cellular data and Wi-Fi (regardless of whether Wi-Fi is available) and send a message to any contact including iMessage contacts, the message originates and sends as SMS with positive submission acknowledgement. There is no suspended iMessage to follow up on. "Send to email address" might be a new option with iOS 12. Lack of "Send as Text Message" indicates that either that the message has sent or else SMS is unavailable.


I'm confident that iOS has no affect on the core cellular voice or SMS. I recommend you read your carrier service contract and visit your carrier's support site and find out exactly to what extent your specific service subscription supports SMS on the iPhone. No way around the limited data and SMS acknowledgement problems without upgrading the cellular service plan even if that means switching carriers. If you do upgrade your service with your existing carrier, compel them to burn you a new SIM to make sure your SMSC steering is current.

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Question marked as Top-ranking reply

Jul 21, 2018 9:27 PM in response to iltym

Ok. I get the picture now. The Messages app and iMessage service are doing exactly what they're geared to do in that situation, date/time stamping included. The problem is that you're either getting a false negative submission acknowledgement or no submission acknowledgement at all from the carrier on the original SMS. If it's no submission acknowledgement at all, that could be due to the carrier using a lower level acknowledgement system not supported by iPhone and thus probably not widely supported by smartphones. This could indicate a non-iPhone certified carrier service. Dirty deeds done dirt cheap.


I reiterate that when I temporarily disable cellular data and Wi-Fi (regardless of whether Wi-Fi is available) and send a message to any contact including iMessage contacts, the message originates and sends as SMS with positive submission acknowledgement. There is no suspended iMessage to follow up on. "Send to email address" might be a new option with iOS 12. Lack of "Send as Text Message" indicates that either that the message has sent or else SMS is unavailable.


I'm confident that iOS has no affect on the core cellular voice or SMS. I recommend you read your carrier service contract and visit your carrier's support site and find out exactly to what extent your specific service subscription supports SMS on the iPhone. No way around the limited data and SMS acknowledgement problems without upgrading the cellular service plan even if that means switching carriers. If you do upgrade your service with your existing carrier, compel them to burn you a new SIM to make sure your SMSC steering is current.

Jul 19, 2018 8:12 AM in response to iltym

I guess iMessage is geared to do its thing if it can, when it can unless you signal it not to and the way to do that is to temporarily disable it by toggling it off in Messages settings on the iPhone whenever viable Wi-Fi is unavailable. Note that toggling it off doesn't sign you out so you can quickly re-enable it by toggling it back on any time. Just curious, though. When the message is ultimately sent as iMessage, does the original SMS remain or does it disappear or get replaced by the newer iMessage? Also, I'm guessing you're forcing the original message to fall back to SMS by temporarily disabling cellular data so let me know if that's incorrect.

Jul 19, 2018 10:45 AM in response to Toot Uncommon

Yeah, once I connect to wifi the original message disappears and is replaced by the iMessage. Also, because my data is left off and I only turn it on when I need to use it to look up something, I guess it is forced to send as sms, although of course I have to do it manually. I would be fine with it sending the text message as an iMessage once i get home but I just wish the time stamp stayed the same!

Jul 21, 2018 2:45 AM in response to iltym

When you do this, also temporarily disable Wi-Fi even if no Wi-Fi is available. Then the message should originate and go as SMS as soon as you hit the send arrow. That should give you effect you're looking for. If not, then also try updating iOS to the latest version which came out a week or two ago and also check for carrier settings update by going into Settings > General > About. Presumably, if a carrier settings update is available, you should get a pop-up saying so.


I did some testing. I disabled cellular data as well as Wi-Fi on the iPhone and sent a message to one of my regular iMessage correspondents. It originated and immediately sent and was delivered as SMS with no latent iMessage retroactivity so far. Then I re-enabled cellular data as well as Wi-Fi and disabled iMessage and sent a message. Same result but with the catch that disabling iMessage disables Text Message Forwarding so this one didn't get forwarded to Messages on my Mac. I also made sure iMessage was working normally with everything enabled before and after testing.


Although the latent, retroactive iMessage makes sense, at least conditionally, the original SMS, if actually acknowledged as sent, absolutely should not disappear or be replaced by a later iMessage. Yet, if it's not actually acknowledged as sent, it should be marked as Not Delivered ! sooner or later. So this sounds like a carrier SMS issue e.g. Delivery Acknowledgement (on top of the requisite Submission Ack) is enabled in carrier settings but not on carrier SMSC. Long story and a manifold measure of imagination as to how that could lead to the effect you're experiencing.


So you may be able to exactly get the effect you're looking for as stated above. On the other hand, there could be a carrier SMS issue at play that may cause you to have to live with the effect you've been experiencing.

Jul 21, 2018 2:46 AM in response to Toot Uncommon

Thank so much for the information, that’s very helpful. I’m wondering whether maybe the problems I’m having might be partly down to the teething problems of the iOS 12 beta I’m on?


Also, you are right in saying that it comes up as being not delivered even though the other person has received it and then when I connect to WiFi what I do is click try again to try and get rid of the question mark and that’s when it changes the time stamp.


I tried what you said about turning WiFi off but for some reason, whether WiFi is turned off or not, I have lost the option to send as text message, and that has been replaced by ‘Send to email address’. Therefore, it seems that I cannot do that anymore?


I’m going to try to update to beta 4 and see if that helps? Thanks again for all the help!

Jul 26, 2018 12:07 PM in response to iltym

I have contacted my provider, and we’re working on the problem.


I just wanted to give you an update on how the situation has developed even further. Now, when I have disabled WiFi and have turned data off, hence have no internet connection, when I try and send a message to someone else who has an iPhone, it simply tells me that I need to activate iMessage to send a message to that person, when I have iMessage clearly enabled. Once I connect back to internet, it acknowledges perfectly that I have imessage enabled. So basically now, when disconnected from internet, I can’t even get to the screen where I press and hold on the message and any options come up, because it won’t even go past the send screen. I really don’t know where that came from. Despite all the problems before, at least my phone was acknowledging that I did have iMessage activated.


I thought I’d post this on here because to my eyes, that’s looking like more of a phone-related problem? Anyway, id be very grateful for any further insight that you might have into this new problem! 😒

Jul 27, 2018 2:50 AM in response to iltym

That makes it sound like SMS is unavailable. With Wi-Fi and cellular data both disabled, you need to see 3G or something like that where the Wi-Fi icon would normally be. Maybe you're out of range or in Airplane mode. Otherwise it's a carrier issue. iMessage can override it when Internet is available but it can't defeat it when Internet is unavailable. Or maybe it's the way you're addressing the message. It needs to be to a cell phone number for SMS to work. Try tapping on the create new message icon and manually entering their cell phone number.

Jul 27, 2018 7:43 AM in response to Toot Uncommon

It seems like sms is unavailable, but the fact remains that I can send messages to people who have an Android phone just fine the second after. It must be a carrier issue. The carrier can give me no help except simply telling me to turn my data on, so I’ll just have to go by that for now. I tried what you said about manually entering the phone number in a new message but it just gave me the same error message. Anyway, thanks again for all the help!

iMessage time stamps messed up

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