Apple Lossless vs AAC Encoder?

Question

Level 1

17 points

Apple Lossless vs AAC Encoder?

Hello,

I am trying to get a little deeper into the differences between Apple Lossless and the AAC Encoder for importing my music. I use iTunes and a Windows 10 PC.

I import a lot of music and I used to import using mp3 encoder then I came across some info in the past that the AAC encoder was the way to go for better quality sound. I also learned that the m4a file created from the AAC encoder is compatible with much of the same software and apps that an mp3 file extension is.

I recently across some info that Apple Lossless is similar to FLAC and of the highest sound quality that is compatible with iTunes, where as FLAC is not. I use the Apple Music app to listen to music digitally so what is compatible with Apple Music first and foremost is key for me. I do also import my music locally to a WD drive which I can access on the go (as well as via Plex) so there are alternative ways for me to access my music.

With using Apple Music service and matching my imported music though, it's so much more convenient to just use the Apple Music app. However I've found in trying out this Apple Lossless that the file in turn is not compatible with a lot of other software, programs and apps.

With all that being said, although I listen to and consume a lot of music, I'm not a huge audiophile when it comes to sound quality. Although I've never really went out of my way to experiment with different files and quality difference. Ideally I would want to have the best sound quality files but to my ears no one has really made me hear the real nuances and differences between all the different file types.

So I feel like I'd want to find the best sound quality so I guess my question in all of this goes back to Apple Lossless vs AAC Encoder. Which should I use? Is there really that much difference in sound quality between Apple Lossless and AAC Encoder? While I'm using Apple Music almost exclusively as the medium for digital music... it would be nice to have a file that I can access across the board should I choose to use something else maybe in the future.

Thanks for any feedback in advance. Greatly appreciated!

Posted on Aug 18, 2018 10:12 AM

Reply

Answer 1

Top-ranking reply

John Lockwood

Level 6

13,691 points

Aug 23, 2018 3:15 AM in response to nacho220

Apple Lossless also known as ALAC is as its names states a lossless compressed copy of the original CD track. It is possible to convert without any loss of quality from a CD track to Apple Lossless to FLAC to WAV to AIFF and back again since these are all lossless formats.

AAC is a lossy compressed format it is generally agreed that for the same bit rate or files size it gives better quality than MP3. Whilst you can convert from CD to AAC and back doing so will irretrievably lose some quality.

Originally Apple Lossless was a proprietary format and hence not widely supported except on Apple devices however several years Apple made it open source like FLAC. Arguably Apple Lossless is still not as widely supported as FLAC but I would say the difference is not as significant as most people think. Windows 10 with Windows Media Player supports as standard both Apple Lossless and FLAC. iTunes only supports Apple Lossless and does not support FLAC.

FLAC and Apple Lossless are identical quality, very similar in file size and both support equivalent capabilities for meta tag information and embedded album artwork. Apple claim their format uses less processing power to decode than FLAC but really these days I would say there are no technical advantages to either, it is merely down to what is compatible with the devices you have.

As it happens I was the first person in the world to get Apple Lossless working with Windows Media Player way back in the era of Windows XP, this was via a DirectShow filter I helped create.

You can use Apple Lossless with all of the following and probably many others although some might require an additional component installing.

Windows Media Player
Windows Media Center
VLC
dbpoweramp
WinAmp
Foobar2000
Plex
Kodi
iPods, iPhones, iPads, Apple TV
iTunes (duh!)
Squeezebox (if you still have one)

With regards to sound quality, this is a very subjective issue. I personally could hear the difference between MP3 and AAC but less so between AAC and Apple Lossless. It will also depend on what you are listening via, if you are listening via cheap ear phones on an iPhone it will no matter as much as if your at home listening via good quality speakers.

I happen to have all mine ripped from CD to Apple Lossless and shared between iTunes and Windows Media Player and Windows Media Center. I have iTunes set to auto-convert to AAC when syncing to my iPhone. The iTunes Store and Apple Music both use 256Kbps AAC.

Reply

Answer 2

nacho220 Author

Level 1

17 points

Aug 23, 2018 7:39 PM in response to John Lockwood

Thanks for your detailed reply, John. Very informative.

I wanted to further my original discussion on this topic here by sharing some more thoughts

These are the steps I take to build and maintain my digital collection...

1. For music I receive in digital format, I will first burn it to CD

2. For music I receive in CD format, I will start right with ripping into iTunes

3. Then I'll rip the CD into iTunes. Long ago I'd rip as mp3, then I switched to AAC a little while ago, as of a few months ago I started ripping Apple Lossless to give it a try.

4. When ripping I add to the fields

-Artist

-Album

-Album Artist (only started using this field more recently)

-Grouping (I use this field to indicate original format - if there is one - like vinyl, CD, cassette)

-Genre

-Comments (I use this field essentially for tags)

-Track

-Disc Number

5. Then once the files are ripped I'll locate the files on the computer and add same tags I added in the comment field under the tag section of the files as well as make sure the album art is associated with each song/file

I upload to a WD drive which I can access on the go. I also have that drive linked to my Plex server so I can access it through Plex should I choose to but ultimately I use the Apple Music app to listen to my digital music as it's most convienient to use in tandem with the Apple Music service (also since Apple Music matches a whole lot of what I rip). Plus it pretty simple design IMO that allows me to quickly get to what I want. A few things I wish it had though would be the ability to rate/star an entire album like you can on the iTunes desktop (I haven't found a third party app that will do this) and also allow you to search or sort or somehow utilize the comments you input for each song. I've found a few third party apps that allow you to view what the comments are but no real way to utilize it in a search or anything.

I've found iTunes does everything I want to do with managing digital music well enough. Actually it's more like - I haven't found something else that does what I want to do. I've tried out stuff like Music Bee and JRiver and they seemed a lot harder to work with. Music Bee was a little better but I've tried JRiver a few times and I don't know why - but it seemed like a big mess and poor design. Of course the lack of support for FLAC seems like it's what would be holding me back for a perfect scenario. The only reason for me to work with FLAC I think would be for when I receive music digitally - receive them in FLAC - and then the CD that I burn it to will in turn be a FLAC master.

I guess all this in turn then would lead back to my original topic Apple Lossless vs AAC since the question would still be what should I rip into iTunes as? I was worried the Apple Lossless might be less compatible for an across-the-board compatibility but you have detailed I should dismiss that thought.

Unless someone can suggest some alternatives to my process which I am open to suggestions on different software and media managers and all that.

There was a thread I saw on a forum somewhere about file management OCD. That could probably describe me as clean, neat properly titled and tagged files are important to me. As well as artwork and storage bang-for-buck. I use to want to have the smallest file size possible but I've learned that obviously that sacrifices quality so I don't mind a larger file size that much anymore, so long as the file is going to be that viable across the board file that I'm ultimately looking for.

Thanks again for any continued feedback and engaging in my discussion on this topic.

Reply

Answer 3

ed2345

Level 9

62,858 points

Aug 28, 2018 6:53 PM in response to nacho220

Nacho,

If you are listening to a lot of Apple Music, you are mostly hearing AAC/256. If it sounds good to you -- as it does to almost all music consumers except audiophiles -- then it would be fine for ripping.

Reply

Answer 4

nacho220 Author

Level 1

17 points

Sep 13, 2018 7:17 AM in response to ed2345

Thanks for all the helpful replies and insight into this topic. I think what I've come up with is ripping my CDs through iTunes into Apple Lossless files. I am under the understanding I can convert these to flac in the future if I so desire.

I understand that if I listen to these through the Apple Music app I am hearing AAC/256. That's fine. At least I'll have my digital library in a lossless form should I choose in the future to use Plex to access my files or something else that accesses those lossless files directly.

I'd rip as flac right away of course but since Apple Music doesn't support, I'm understanding that Apple Lossless is just about the same.

If I receive an album as a digital release, such as through Bandcamp for example, I am choosing the flac version and first burning the flac files to a disc so I have a disc version in flac. Then ripping that CD into iTunes and of course those will rip as Apple Lossless...but I'll have a CD version in high quality too.

I think that those steps are what might work best for me based upon the feedback I've gotten here and on other forums. I hope being tied into the iTunes and Apple ecosystem like I am doesn't come back to bite me in the butt in the future, but I think the changes I've made to managing my digital library have made it easy to shift elsewhere should I need to.

Also someone suggested using Media Monkey. I've given it a try but haven't really gotten the hang of it yet.... my library view seems to keep disappearing on me and I have to re-import them.

Still open to any feedback and discussion on this topic. Don't need to consider my follow-up here as a closed case.

Thanks again!

Reply

Answer 5

Sep 13, 2018 9:30 AM in response to nacho220

There are some tools to convert between FLAC and Apple Lossless without having to first burn them to CD. If you can do this without CDs it would be a lot quicker. On a Mac XLD is the best choice to do this, it can do it in both directions i.e. FLAC to Apple Lossless or Apple Lossless to FLAC.

Reply

Answer 6

ed2345

Level 9

62,858 points

Sep 13, 2018 5:18 PM in response to nacho220

If I receive an album as a digital release, such as through Bandcamp for example, I am choosing the flac version

Nacho,

For the past several years, Bandcamp has been offering ALAC as a download option, so that may meet your needs better. From their website: "You can also download in FLAC, ALAC (Apple Lossless), AAC, Ogg Vorbis, WAV and AIFF formats. These options are, as we say in the interface, for "audiophiles and nerds.""

... burning the flac files to a disc so I have a disc version in flac. Then ripping that CD into iTunes and of course those will rip as Apple Lossless...but I'll have a CD version in high quality too.

Not clear what you mean here. Since you refer to ripping as Apple Lossless, do you mean you have burned an audio CD? If so, you don't really have "a disc version in FLAC," you have an audio CD. You could also have burned a data CD of the FLAC files, but iTunes will not rip (or even read) such a CD.

Also be aware that home-burned CDs have a much higher failure rate than commercial (factory produced) CDs, and are not really a good choice for long-term backup.

Reply

Answer 7

Sep 18, 2018 3:00 AM in response to nacho220

Apple Music as stated uses AAC 256Kbps this is not a lossless format. There is no point converting a digital download to a CD and then ripping that CD, it merely wastes a CD, actually might reduce the quality slightly and takes you longer.

If you get FLAC and want to use Apple Lossless then the best option is to use a utility to convert directly between the two. There is no point converting AAC to Apple Lossless you don't get any better quality than the original AAC.

Reply

Answer 8

nacho220 Author

Level 1

17 points

Sep 18, 2018 12:12 PM in response to ed2345

ed2345 wrote:

Thanks for your reply, ed2345. Sorry I may have not listed it out properly what steps I take as far as a digital release. I am burning to CD because I also like to have a physical copy, should I choose to listen on CD, or just have it as a backup. I know it's not the best long-term solution as many people have said in countless articles and forums... but I don't mind taking the step of first making a CD of the album/tracks/songs/etc.

With all that being said and to bring in to account what John Lockwood also has posted in regards to this discussion... I am burning flac files onto CD with foobar2000. I have been under the impression that the audio that would be presented on that CD would be of flac quality. The step I do take next is to rip that CD with iTunes - and of course since iTunes doesn't rip as flac - I will rip as ALAC. This, yes would be an audio CD, of course not data CD since iTunes does not support flac.

If my impression is wrong that this audio CD I created is not of "flac quality" so-to-speak then I guess it doesn't matter should I receive a digital release, such as from Bandcamp, as flac or ALAC. But when all is said and done, the tracks/files I am creating as my digital music library are stored as ALAC. From the discussion here I am gathering that if I can't store as flac (due to no iTunes support) the next best - and very smiliar - this is to at least store a master digital track/file as ALAC since it is a lossless format, as opposed to mp3's - which I've done in the past... so at least what I have digitally is of high quality.

Hopefully that spells out my process a little better. But maybe my thinking is wrong along this process from what you guys have replied.

Reply

Answer 9

nacho220 Author

Level 1

17 points

Sep 18, 2018 12:17 PM in response to John Lockwood

I do understand that even though iTunes is ripping the song into ALAC format - that because I also use Apple Music and it is either matching or uploading the ripped track - if I playback anything using the Apple Music app that I will be listening at AAC/256 quality.

I think at this point more of the process I take - thanks in part to all of your great feedback and discussion - is how do I build a master digital music library of the highest quality with also being a part of Apple's iTunes/Apple Music ecosystem.

So if I want to listen and access those master files through, say, Plex. I know those tracks will be the ALAC tracks I ripped.

Reply

Answer 10

ed2345

Level 9

62,858 points

Sep 18, 2018 5:38 PM in response to nacho220

If my impression is wrong that this audio CD I created is not of "flac quality" so-to-speak then I guess it doesn't matter should I receive a digital release, such as from Bandcamp, as flac or ALAC.

Nacho - OK, I see what you are doing. Yes, if the FLAC is CD-quality, then the audio CD that you burn from it will be a lossless representation of the track. (At risk of complicating the discussion, I should point out that some commercially sold FLAC files are better-than-CD-quality, and if you burn such a file to audio CD, you will indeed be degrading it.)

Reply

Answer 11

turingtest2

Level 10

274,552 points

Aug 18, 2018 10:18 AM in response to nacho220

Rip an album you know really well in Apple Lossless and 256k AAC (Apple Music quality). Listen to the two recordings. Can you tell the difference? If not I'd rip at 256k.

tt2

Reply