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systemsetup, timed, and multiple NTP servers

So I know with High Sierra, MacOS has stoped using ntpd for time sync and now only uses timed. I've also noticed that timed does not support any arguments and gains its information either from using the Date & Time pane in System Prefs or by using the terminal command "systemsetup -setnetworktimeserver". Now from my searching, it looks like it still stores the time server names in /etc/ntp.conf. However it looks like timed will only check the first line in ntp.conf regardless of how many servers are listed in the conf file.


To further explain here is what I'm trying to do. In my organization by default we must set our office NTP server is the primary server for security purposes. However, this server isn't available to the public so we need to also list a secondary server (time.apple.com) for computers to use when off network. Whether we express the secondary server with a comma value in the GUI or by manually editing the ntp.conf file, it appears that timed will only check the first line of ntp.conf -- it never checks the secondary server if the primary server is unavailable.


Can anyone else provide further comment on if this is a bug or is working as intended (or maybe I'm doing something wrong?) We really need the ability for High Sierra to check for multiple time servers incase the primary is not available. For those remote users who let their battery drain completely, the computers are coming back up with a default time. And since we limit them to standard users, it requires our interaction with them to correct the time.


Thanks in advance!

macOS High Sierra (10.13.6)

Posted on Aug 29, 2018 8:44 AM

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Posted on Aug 29, 2018 12:40 PM

...but would love to know if the ability to check multiple servers is a bug or they just didn't implement it (either because they didn't think of it or for security purposes).

Once Apple lets me know, I'll be sure to pass it on ... (lol, like I have any special insight on what Apple does or does not implement 😁)


Regardless, you can try a "blind" Product Feedback submission or try using Apple's Bug Reporter to see if you can get any traction on a resolution, especially if it turns out to be a "bug."

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Aug 29, 2018 12:40 PM in response to cdegaeta

...but would love to know if the ability to check multiple servers is a bug or they just didn't implement it (either because they didn't think of it or for security purposes).

Once Apple lets me know, I'll be sure to pass it on ... (lol, like I have any special insight on what Apple does or does not implement 😁)


Regardless, you can try a "blind" Product Feedback submission or try using Apple's Bug Reporter to see if you can get any traction on a resolution, especially if it turns out to be a "bug."

Aug 29, 2018 12:24 PM in response to Tesserax

Tesserax wrote:


...but would love to know if the ability to check multiple servers is a bug or they just didn't implement it (either because they didn't think of it or for security purposes).

Once Apple lets me know, I'll be sure to pass it on ... (lol, like I have any special insight on what Apple does or does not implement 😁)


Regardless, you can try a "blind" Product Feedback submission or try using Apple's Bug Reporter to see if you can get any traction on a resolution, especially if it turns out to be a "bug."

Now THIS is extremely helpful and exactly what I was looking for from a high level discussion!


I've already submitted a Product Feedback shortly after creating this topic. I will now submit as a bug on the dev site. Just curious, when you do (hopefully) find out, do you plan to respond to this topic? Just curious as I don't want to miss your update.


Thanks again for your helpfulness!

Aug 29, 2018 11:46 AM in response to cdegaeta

FWIW. I came across similar findings as you. Unfortunately, I'm not sure if there is a workable option available for us here. Apple seems to be on a path of deprecating a number of processes with every new release of macOS. Think 'telnet" as another example. Not sure what 'surprises" are in store with Mojave. You would think if Apple still wanted to get involved beyond a consumer-grade OS product, they may want to consider providing either the functionality for 'advanced' users or another OS version for them so that they can meet their business support goals.

Aug 29, 2018 11:57 AM in response to Old Toad

Old Toad wrote:


You certainly are rude to someone who's only trying to help. You owe him an apology. With that kind of attitude you'll be hard pressed to get others to jump in and offer help. Think about it.


User uploaded file


There is no rudeness to my completely factual comment. If I started insulting him, then I would apologize. His reply has nothing to do with the case and he is trying to pad his points. Plain and simple. He posted a link to a security update that has absolutely nothing to do with the service (timed) and the OS (High Sierra) in my original message.


Thanks guys for making this whole topic completely irrelevant. I thought the high pointers were suppose to be helpful, clearly not. I'll just re-post the topic in a week to separate the real issue at hand from this mess. When I do please be sure to stay away from it.

Aug 29, 2018 11:32 AM in response to cdegaeta

cdegaeta wrote:


This is completely irrelevant and has nothing to do with the issue I posted (or the OS). Stop trying to pad your points.


If you can remove your reply please do so.


Dear cdegaeta—


Sometimes this is used as device to bump your post back to the top. Once it is buried pages and pages deep—you have lost all eyes on the issue.


I apologize if you are offended.

Aug 29, 2018 11:36 AM in response to leroydouglas

leroydouglas wrote:


cdegaeta wrote:


This is completely irrelevant and has nothing to do with the issue I posted (or the OS). Stop trying to pad your points.


If you can remove your reply please do so.


Dear cdegaeta—


Sometimes this is used as device to bump your post back to the top. Once it is buried pages and pages deep—you have lost all eyes on the issue.


I apologize if you are offended.

Thanks, but I don't need your help. I'll monitor the post myself and bump if necessary.


You are trying to pad your points, just stop.

Aug 29, 2018 12:02 PM in response to Tesserax

Tesserax wrote:


FWIW. I came across similar findings as you. Unfortunately, I'm not sure if there is a workable option available for us here. Apple seems to be on a path of deprecating a number of processes with every new release of macOS. Think 'telnet" as another example. Not sure what 'surprises" are in store with Mojave. You would think if Apple still wanted to get involved beyond a consumer-grade OS product, they may want to consider providing either the functionality for 'advanced' users or another OS version for them so that they can meet their business support goals.

Thanks for the confirmation and agreed! I have no problem with them depreciating ntpd for timed, but would love to know if the ability to check multiple servers is a bug or they just didn't implement it (either because they didn't think of it or for security purposes).

Aug 29, 2018 12:40 PM in response to cdegaeta

Just curious, when you do (hopefully) find out, do you plan to respond to this topic? Just curious as I don't want to miss your update.

If I garner anything useful, I will be sure to update this post. We're all "volunteers" here, so I really can't make any promises, especially if I don't come up with anything any time soon.

Aug 29, 2018 12:40 PM in response to Tesserax

Tesserax wrote:


Just curious, when you do (hopefully) find out, do you plan to respond to this topic? Just curious as I don't want to miss your update.

If I garner anything useful, I will be sure to update this post. We're all "volunteers" here, so I really can't make any promises, especially if I don't come up with anything any time soon.


No worries! I won't hold it against you. In fact I'd like to award you the points (as long as you'll be able to reply to this post after the fact). If you can confirm that I'll mark your answer the "solved" answer.


Oh, and I just got finished submitted a dev bug report as well.

Aug 29, 2018 12:49 PM in response to cdegaeta

Great! Hopefully you'll get a resolution or, at least, an "official" explanation from Apple. Either way, good luck! I certainly can understand the frustration of having to make redundant 'desktop visits' when it was 'just working' before. Again, if I get anything, I will post back ... and I'm not really here for the points. I get my encouragement to continue supporting folks here when I can actually help solve their problems ... and, frankly, it's also a great way to learn stuff.

systemsetup, timed, and multiple NTP servers

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