I'm sick of these overload messages! Is there ANY fix in sight? (Part 2)

hi angelgraffiti,

presumably you are running with nothing major in the way of third party stuff?

you need to work out the bottle neck. if you are using hi sample rates and a slow or system drive you could be getting audio streaming bottle necks. if you are using 3rd party plugs and lots of cpu resources and/or low buffer settings you could be getting a processing bottle neck. RAM could be an issue.

i would start by setting your I/O buffer to at least 256, if not 512. then set your process buffer range to large. i would be surprised if that did not help. make sure your safety buffer is off.

you could try recording to a different drive to one that is playing back. also, make sure your drive is not on the same bus as the the onyx. that means you will definitely have to get a separate firewire card if you have not done so already. remember the macs only come with 1 FW bus (many ports for it but its only 1 bus)

Hi Rohan,

if the bottleneck is a harddrive, why should you get a cpu-overload?
BTW when I used leopard logic crashed permanently when choosing "processing buffer large". I have a separate S-ATA drive for audio with journaling turned off.

Eddie

if the bottleneck is a harddrive, why should you get a cpu-overload?

it's not necessarily a cpu overload. all that happens is that the cpu didn't get the info it needed in time. whether that is because it couldn't process the data it had, or whether it couldn't get the data it needed, we are not told - and i wish we were, because it would make trouble-shooting a lot easier.

the problem too with the 'overload first time and then never again in the same session' is probably to distribution of processing (multi-threading). it is harder for the cpu to work out how to distribute the processing amongst the cores. it may be partly what is causing the headaches with people on the newest computers.

your external drive should be fine though. if you are using powercore, and you have an interface on the same bus you may find that is the cause. if i were you i would run through the built-in audio for a while and see if you don't see some improvement. and also have another go at the larger process buffer. if you have a really powerful computer try making the i/o buffer smaller, not larger. that may work too.

it is most likely a conflict though with something 3rd party. completely clean logic installations even on the new computers seem to be fine (or so i have heard). but certain 3rd party things don't play nice - regardless of who is to blame.

What is your audio card?
Have you tried to disconnect your card and switch to internal Audio?
Are you running at 96Khz?

I always ask about that to all the guys that declare the overload message!

The reasons of overload message are:
1) the Audio interface
2) the speed of the disk
3) a poor ammount of RAM
4) works over than 48Khz
5) the use of third parties plugins

the solution possible are:

1) using a separate super fast HD for Audio
2) Disable spotligth features and Journaling on the Audio disk
3) switch to internal audio in order to be sure about the compatibility with your system and your additional DSP and/or bad driver

For UAD user: check the better MIN_GMT setting for your system... UAD works with ZERO host CPU power request.
(Powercore comes with Native plugins and uses a big ammount of host CPU)

G
anyway

The first step to see if your Mac and your audio card work well is to disconnect your external card and switching to Built-in Audio.

G 😉

flood123 wrote:
AngelGraffiti,
How fast is the hard drive in your macbook pro? I am guessing it is 5400rpm. Are you recording to your system drive? You need to be recording to a drive that is at least 7200rpm. A faster firewire external drive might be your solution.

Part of this problem Mac users have with using a single internal drive
is not necessarily Logic but a combination of Logic and OS-X which tends to write to the system drive quite a bit, actually it writes to the system drive a ^%## of a lot! <g>

Between OS-X writing swap files plus journaling the system bogs down and eventually overloads. Logic's drive use indicator will only show what Logic is reading/writing from the drive, not what the system is writing/reading.

I've posted this before, you're all sick of it but it works.
Disable Journaling, (it was designed for servers), I've never heard a single person say "hey, journaling saved my %$#" Just back up your system regularly, standard housekeeping.

Ok, I've disabled Spotlight, Dashboard and Journaling. Much happier system, smoother, faster...etc.

Open system preferences, under Accounts/Login Items, see what's running in the background, less is more.

As Rohan mentioned, up Logic's Audio Buffer to 512, set processor buffer range to large. I'm guessing the internal drive will work ok.

All said, I never record to the internal drive (laptop) unless it's partitioned. I have an 3yr old Acer 1.6gHz single core that runs the Bootcamp OS 🙂 and can record 8-10 tracks while playing back 16 from an internal 80 gig drive, there's no reason you can't get the same performance if not better.

pancenter-

I'm working in many studios with LP8 without problems

my projects are composed by 90/100 and more tracks (audio and instruments) with heavy plugins... I don't have overload message... just one or two in 1 working day... but same as LP7
All overloads has been caused by heavy use of Instruments and plugs

If you got too much overload message with only 4 tracks, my suggestion is:
maybe your mac require technical assistance

Message was edited by: fermusic

fermusic wrote:
If you got too much overload message with only 4 tracks, my suggestion is:
maybe your mac require technical assistance

That's a lot of Macs requiring technical assistance.

Most people I've seen who don't have this problem are running a PowerPC G4 or G5. 90% of the time it is that, and then the System Overload seems to be justified (90+ tracks / heavy plugin case). It does the job it is designed to do.

So this must be a problem with Intel Macs! Something is causing the sensitivity of the message to be too high which is why it is triggered by ridiculously low CPU/HD stress.

I wish people would stop trying to help by suggesting more RAM, faster hard drives, more cores, etc etc. It's not that!! We have 4 or 6 or 8 or 12GB RAM, 2 or 4 or 8 fast cores, 5400 or 7200 or 10 or 15000 RPM SATA RAIDED HDs and we still get the problem with 1 audio track and 1 EQ, or 2 software instruments and 2 compressors.

My 8 year old P3 550MHz PC can play back 20+ audio tracks (32bit float, 44.1kHz) without a problem. Completely different software/hardware but I think examples like this should make it OBVIOUS that we are not dealing with a problem caused by insufficient CPU/HD/RAM!

PS Someone said turning off Spotlight is good. I thought so too until I noticed that EXS24 couldn't find any of the SDIR impulse responses. Turning it back on (indexing of the System drive too) fixed that.

Cheers
R

For the record, I used to have them with my Mac Pro Dual 2g. With a new 8 core and 8 gigs ram, I haven't had anything weird until last night, when recording a midi track in a session of about 12 virtual instrument tracks. I got a "Can't Sync Midi and Audio" then "System Overload." I hit stop, tried again, got it again. Quit Logic. Relaunched the file, and went on recording without incident.

TH

rrrobo wrote:

So this must be a problem with Intel Macs! Something is causing the sensitivity of the message to be too high which is why it is triggered by ridiculously low CPU/HD stress.

this is the first time I read a clear final point about that.
the problem appears only on Intel Macs! ( if yes, they must wait for next Logic 8.x update)
That is what you said... but I see many people that use PPC macs that stay on Tiger!

My answer is aimed at those who still use old G5!

to my personal experience there are not reasons to stay on Tiger for G5 owner.
....except for some deprecable tip about using demo Waves 5.2 or so 😉

I wish people would stop trying to help by suggesting more RAM, faster hard drives, more cores, etc etc. It's not that!! We have 4 or 6 or 8 or 12GB RAM, 2 or 4 or 8 fast cores, 5400 or 7200 or 10 or 15000 RPM SATA RAIDED HDs and we still get the problem with 1 audio track and 1 EQ, or 2 software instruments and 2 compressors.

the suggestion about Fast hard drive are the must for G5 owner

PS Someone said turning off Spotlight is good. I thought so too until I noticed that EXS24 couldn't find any of the SDIR impulse responses. Turning it back on (indexing of the System drive too) fixed that.

This is true only in part because only happens the first time you open a project coming from another computer (or Logic demo songs.. it is the same)
After saving the SDIR are immediately found
EXS24 doesn't need spotligth....

G

fermusic wrote:
EXS24 doesn't need spotligth....

Sorry, yeah, I meant Space Designer!

Cheers

😉

I'm not strongly Space Designer user (I prefer UAD Dreamverb or Plate 140) but i'm working for other studios (mastering/remix) and I know what i say.

only the first time Space Designer search for his IR...

I use CDfinder for indexing my Mac... but I'm searching for a better one.

Cheers

there are 2 separate problems, at seems fairly well documented now:

1. genuine overloads, which is the first thing to look at.

2. the 'settling down' first pass overload. particularly endemic to multi-core intels.

if you are getting repeated overloads with low stress projects, then it is almost certainly a combination of your set-up and something 3rd party. as i have said before, you can moan that 'logic has broken my third party', but from everything i have heard, virgin systems (ie Lp8 and nothing else) run without problems, except for the occasional number 2 (...errr...as it were)

it's not good news i know but knowing this is a good starting point for trouble-shooting.

Rohan Stevenson1 wrote:

if you are getting repeated overloads with low stress projects, then it is almost certainly a combination of your set-up and something 3rd party. as i have said before.......

I see your previous post, and I agree with 3rd party Audio card ...
But I disappoint about UAD-1 DSP card!

UAD DSP card are fully compatible with all macs!!! (maybe only the new 8 core get some problem...????) I'm not sure about that because many people are envious of the quality of uad.

Usually I don't believe to everything that people writes in the forums without a my personal verification.
This also applies to me: do not give much credit to what I am writing
Do your tests by yourself 😉


The logic developers work closely with all hardware manufacturers ... But only some of them are always very careful about Apple improvements.

My experience: Motu and UAD are on the top of the list for the best compatibility

I would like to add I am using 2xUADe cards on a Mac Pro 4x2.66 and do not get this overload problem when not using any UAD plugs but the cards are in.

If I run EXTREMELY LOW buffer settings with a bunch of UAD cards, then I get overloads. However, UAD will and always has said you need to use a larger buffer size with their plugs if you are using a lot of them. I have seen this to be the case on both my G5 dual 1.8 and my current machine.

I can get away with a couple as long as I don't chain them too deeply. I am running at a buffer size of 32.

AD DSP card are fully compatible with all macs!!! (maybe only the new 8 core get some problem...????)

yes this is right. there is compatibility issue with the new intel macs and logic and UAD - but apparently not with other DAWs.

i think the loudest complaints are from people who have bought new macs that ought to be able run a squillion tracks and space designers and yet have problems - its UAD cards and logic not getting along together in these situations.