Boot Camp Crashes in Windows 10 1903

Back to the win10 issue at hand... here is what I found, having gone right to 1903 from the start. Yes, it and the BC "5" drivers DO have an issue that according to what I read did NOT occur previously. I read suggestions about disabling a certain specific file. I found another suggestion and followed it. Booted fine in safe mode which told me the issue was some piece of the BC software was causing the issue. Hit task manager and saw that there was an item called "Boot Camp Manager" that was a startup item. I disabled it. win10 booted and ran just fine.

The item I disabled seem to be responsible for a control panel that allows choosing a startup disk, and a setting to the keyboard (unfortunately, the BC software fails to make win10 recognize the keypads on extended keyboards, I had to search up a registry entry edit to fix that). There was NO software update from Apple to update the files causing this issue, forcing me to seek out another solution, which I found here:

https://www.crystalidea.com/blog/bootcamp-and-windows-10-1903-may-update

I chose a different method to get win10 running that he did via editing a specific file. Starting with "Install 7Zip and Brigadier." I used this third party method to actually install the correct BC 6 files... this is kind of necessary because Apple allows access to prior BC version BUT not the one that addresses the issue.

Obviously, this not "sanctioned" by Apple in any way. However, it does NOT modify any of their BC software, it is used as distributed by Apple.

As for the fan issue, Apple has a proprietary controller to regulate all their fan speeds. This apparently does NOT interface with any third party or much higher quality fans. To get better cooling with quieter running, one must not just replace various fans (some of which take considerable effort) BUT purchase a fan controller that you can MANUALLY adjust speed from inside the machine. Makes for a lot of wires and little back boxes. Not a very "Mac-like" solution. BUT there IS a reason so many tenaciously cling onto these 10 year old machines...

Riverside_Guy wrote:

Back to the win10 issue at hand... here is what I found, having gone right to 1903 from the start. Yes, it and the BC "5" drivers DO have an issue that according to what I read did NOT occur previously.

Firstly,...

MP (4,1/5,1) + W10 1903 + BC5.x -> Not Working

MP (4,1/5,1) + W10 (Less than 1903) + BC5.x -> Working

My perspective is that W10 1903 is the issue.

Secondly, there is the issue of BC5 vs BC6 certification for W10.

I chose a different method to get win10 running that he did via editing a specific file. Starting with "Install 7Zip and Brigadier." I used this third party method to actually install the correct BC 6 files... this is kind of necessary because Apple allows access to prior BC version BUT not the one that addresses the issue.

If you choose to mix BC5 and BC6 drivers, it is your choice. It is not necessarily a ‘bad’ choice, but unsupported.

Obviously, this not "sanctioned" by Apple in any way. However, it does NOT modify any of their BC software, it is used as distributed by Apple.

We can debate semantics of ‘modification’ till the cows come home.

Not a very "Mac-like" solution.

This is a key factor in Apple’s decision making.

BUT there IS a reason so many tenaciously cling onto these 10 year old machines...

There are many reasons, not just one. As long as you have a functional system that meets your ‘needs’ and ‘wants’, all is well that ends well per The Bard.

This morning was VERY interesting! I had a choice of 2 paths to follow... what I kind of detailed above which involved third party software to get BC packages not necessarily meant for me to get around an apparent bug in the Apple HAL file. OR follow a friends advice to boot in Safe mode, then look in ask Manager for startup items. Launched win10, it right away KNEW there were issues (it had been BSODing after my desktop loaded). Through a series of blue screen I eventually ended up with one that allowed me to start in Safe mode.. this I did. It DID load into a black desktop and by the Start Menu it indicated Safe. Got the the StartUp tab in Task Mgr. Hmmm, "Boot Camp Manager." Disabled it. Boom, it restarted in fine form.

NOW it gets interesting. I see an Apple item in the Start Menu. THIS apparently looks for updates! I vaguely remember back in my 7/10 days years ago, there was a pop up for this in the lower right hand corner. I run this and it says I have updates for WiFi and "Apple Software." I try both, it complains about some incorrect certificate then stops. I run JUST the generic software, works fine, Do the WiFi next, no problem, all is ok.

Even though "Boot Camp Manager" is NOT running, it SEEMS some BC stuff DID get installed. My issues with time are now GONE, every restart shows the correct time. AND audio now WORKS (output gave me a few choices, my headset, or digital output, but 2 that looked to be identical. I have an external in the analog output, so whatever I chose in Device Manager works just fine.

SOOO, what I want to know is exactly what functions does Boot Camp Manager give me... i.e. what am I missing?

The AppleControlPanel.exe 5.x versions will not work on W10, and will BSoD. Are you familiar with Brigadier (https://github.com/timsutton/brigadier)?

Also, see when are boot camp drivers going to be up… - Apple Community for reference.

You can also try compatibility mode, as a test.

Ah, Loner T, we have spoken, no? Yes I very much have a very new win10 1903 installation (cMP5,1 is my hardware) on its own SSD in Bay 1. Played a few days w/o any BC components, audio was not happening (it is a MUST) and the time was 4 hours ahead (I heard something in the BC package fixed that). So I install the BC5 package from Apple. Boom, BSOD.

Now I am not sure if we can actually talk here about "alternatives." We shall see. I kinda delved into the issue and here is what I found out.

This is based on what I have come across that I consider very credible.

There is a specific file BC installs that apparently is the root cause. From what I read, it SEEMS it is a big key so that any of the other pieces work. That file is:

c:\windows\system32\drivers\MacHALDriver.sys

Obviously, you can not do anything IN win10, so the suggestion was to use the Paragon software to rename the file (implying that it gets called by name at some point). With this renamed file, you CAN get win10 booted BUT you lose all functionality of the BC bits & pieces. In a more radical step, it was suggested one get the BC stuff intended for a iMacPro1,1 (supposedly the third party (github) software that does that gets them directly from Apple's own servers, something we Mac users are not allowed to get). Installing THAT was said to fix the issue.

Curious what you think?

As for hardware, oh boy. I DO bet where they are going with the new machine, is is totally a BTO machine and tricked out even halfway to what it is capable of may mean tens of thousands. I am 100% convinced that the machine so MANY of us have been clamoring since the trashcan disaster was a mini tower just like out cMP with a modern motherboard. Frankly, if they made a motherboard that I could slap into my 5,1 with more up to date bits & pieces, I'd gladly pay a grand or so, maybe more. ****** if every Mac user I know also wants exactly this. And no way in six months would I consider paying 5800 bucks for a machine specced for a 2 year old laptop ESPECIALLY one where I wa **** out from using nVidia cards.

AND I have it narrowed down a bit more. I tried to run AppleControlPanel.exe, boom BSOD, WDF Violation. Same as when it was booted with "Boot Camp Manager" as a startup item (and being at startup, required a safe start to determine what was going on). Think I can live without that item... maybe they'll get around to fixing it in 2-3 years.

So there sure seems to be an issue with that piece of software and 1903 win10.

And good grief, I wanted to set up an iCloud drove to share files between systems, it was like pulling teeth to even FIND where to download the **** thing, I kept getting sent to the page on the apple website where there is NO download link at all, only huge pictures with even huger text. AND I have no clue where the installer is... other stuff puts it in the Downloads folders,m but noooo. I did run it from the bottom of the browser when it gave me the opportunity (I have Chrome set as my default, but every freaking link I click on goes to edge, grrrr.)

Riverside_Guy wrote:

AND I have it narrowed down a bit more. I tried to run AppleControlPanel.exe, boom BSOD, WDF Violation. Same as when it was booted with "Boot Camp Manager" as a startup item (and being at startup, required a safe start to determine what was going on). Think I can live without that item... maybe they'll get around to fixing it in 2-3 years.

It is fixed in newer driver packages.

So there sure seems to be an issue with that piece of software and 1903 win10.

Right-click on the .exe and post a screen shot of properties, with version number.

And good grief, I wanted to set up an iCloud drove to share files between systems, it was like pulling teeth to even FIND where to download the **** thing, I kept getting sent to the page on the apple website where there is NO download link at all, only huge pictures with even huger text. AND I have no clue where the installer is... other stuff puts it in the Downloads folders,m but noooo. I did run it from the bottom of the browser when it gave me the opportunity (I have Chrome set as my default, but every freaking link I click on goes to edge, grrrr.)

Run Apple Software Update. One of the pop-ups should be iCloud. Do not install any updates.

I was able to get 1903 working with a clean 1903 install on my Mac Pro 4,1 (to 5,1) with 144 bootrom. Note: this approach of putting in an RX580 means you won't have a boot screen or options screen and won't have bootcamp. In other words, you boot into Windows by default and if you want to go into OSX you will need to blindly alt/option into OSX.

Steps:

-Create Win10 install onto USB using MS Creation Tool.

-Using GT120 for bootscreen with Win10 USB, alt/option to Win10 USB and install Win10 on a new drive.

-IMPORTANT - Installation will finish and windows will have said the GT120 is a 9500GT. Go to device manager and UNINSTALL the 9500GT. Shut down the computer. (...I also followed some steps so there isn't an auto device update but I don't think that this matters with my approach).

-IMPORTANT - Put in RX580 (or other Win10 supported card). Restart computer.

-Mine booted into Windows correctly

-I was able to successfully load new Radeon drivers following this procedure.

What Works/Doesn't Work:

Surprisingly, everything works (WiFi, Audio, etc) but my Bluetooth.

A 2010 MacPro does not natively support due to lack of W10 drivers. If you really want W10, I suggest installing W7/W8.1 first and then running an in-place upgrade to W10.

iciconnect wrote:

Just so you know my first installment of Windows was with Windows 7. From there to Windows 8.1. Oddly 3 years ago there was a forced upgrade to Windows 10 from Microsoft. So each Windows upgrade worked fine.

This is the expected path.

This is the first unrecoverable issue I’ve experienced from an upgrade from Windows.

If W10 becomes unrepairable, unfortunately, on such upgraded instances, an installer has many issues, because it does not have the correct drivers. Building one is also problematic, because of lack of drivers.

• Where did the W10 drivers for a 2010 MP come from?
• You should have a Bootcamp.xml which contains a line stating Product Version? What is the version you have?

Here is an example...

<ProductManufacturer>Apple Inc.</ProductManufacturer>
<ProductVersion>6.0.6136</ProductVersion>
<ProductCode>{FCFFE6B6-BAE8-490E-88D0-097A9DA1C43D}</ProductCode>

BC 5.x drivers are not W10 certified, but BC6.x are. If they are installed on a W7/W8.1 system that is upgraded to W10, such drivers are 'grand-fathered'.

SIP does not interfere with NTFS selection. In fact, Switch between Windows and macOS with Boot Camp - Apple Support is the recommended method on Macs which do get the upgraded version of AppleControlPanel.exe.

Paragon NTFS conflicts with Apple's native NTFS driver. This is one of the reasons systems that have it installed, do not show the BC/Windows partition in System Preferences -> Startup Disks. There are known cases of NTFS corruption with both installed. I highly recommend good backups of Windows to avoid future issues.

The drivers on W10 1903 are generic WHQL drivers, and should work in most cases, but users who use them complain of WiFi and Audio issues. If they work in your specific case, that is good.