Why is Apple Mail rearranging my mailboxes after I manually move them.

MBP 2012

Catilina 10.15.3

Add me to the list. I first noticed the problem several months ago. It's unfortunate that it has affected so many and is still an on going problem. Like some of you, I've spent a lot of time w. Apple Care and it always ended with "we'll have it escalated". I actually removed 8 of my email acc and leaving 2 for about 3 months not. Decided to reinstall all of them a few days ago, hoping that the problem has been resolve. Same ol' story. Thank you all for sharing, for a while i thought it was bc' I had an older computer that caused this.

Thanks so much for the replies thus far on my previous inquiry-and you all may already be aware, but we're not alone on the discussion forum in regard to this concern:

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/250774082

I’ve been watching this thread awhile. Like others expected Apple to have fixed the issue due to it’s happening to so many of us.

I just started an Apple Support dialogue on Twitter. I actually have directed them to this conversation. 🤞🏼

Did Apple Support reach out yo you via Twitter after you responded?

They've been in a Q&A dialogue with me. Had me test in safe mode. (Still occurs).

So...

They set up a call with me tomorrow at noon about this mail issue.

Not sure how talking to 1 person will fix a problem that is affecting the masses but I’ll help if it gets this solved.

That is useful to know. Who would have imagined that something called Apple Support Communities based at an apple.com Domain would be monitored by the company running it. It really does beggar belief doesn't it.

Well done on pressing this. I find it absolutely incredible that Apple were unaware. They broke Mail once before some years ago and it was an eternity before they fixed it. Hopefully we will not have to suffer for too much longer.

I'm glad this may be addressed. In addition to moving mailboxes, I actually had subfolders move from one mail account to another along with all the messages in that folder. I am not a programmer but this sounds like maybe some kind of potential "overflow" problem as the last folder would move into the next account below it. This was very disturbing and fortunately I have not seen it happen since I upgraded to 10.14 from 10.12 but the random moving location of mailboxes in the left frame still occurs. Besides the convenience factor of arranging mailboxes as you would like, I am wondering if there are security issues to worry about regarding the stability of how MacMail handles mail overall? I like the app and don't really want to move to something else.

Brilliant (I think!)

This has been bugging me for 6 months; yesterday I tried your suggestion (7 Gmail mailboxes) and so far - so far - they have stayed put.

Like you, I'm worried about calling it too soon, but until today the mailboxes were out of order every single time I looked, and today they have not moved!

I was nervous about deleting the mailboxes but nothing bad happened.

Thank you (with fingers crossed) so much!

Update: Day 7

Inboxes still staying where I want them to, none of them have moved.

I have added a Yahoo account too with the same steps as in the article, but the "App Password" generated from Yahoo. I suppose this will work with Hotmail Accounts too. Here are two screenshots of how to generate an App Password for both Yahoo and Microsoft accounts.

YAHOO

HOTMAIL/MICROSOFT

EIM

I shared this solution on another Apple support thread https://discussions.apple.com/thread/250774082?answerId=252606231022&page=4

and got this worrying reply:

Thanks.

So basically the Appletoolbox article is telling us to do this for our Google accounts:

1. Use much less safe app-specific-passwords (Which A. Google is going to get rid of, and B. is MUCH less secure than Oauth)
2. Manually configure the mail server settings (bad idea)
3. Because of this old tech method: NOT automatically also sync Google account based calendars and contacts (not an option for me)

It MIGHT fix the order of inboxes, but CERTAINLY messes up my Calendars and Contacts. That's worse.

So, thanks, but no thanks.

I guess I'll be asking Apple what the status is of my support request on Monday.

Now I wonder if I should have done it! My inboxes are still in order though.

Hey John, thanks for this.

There is 'security' and then there are some who are very concerned about "security." I'm part of the first camp. However, It remains for each one to evaluate the risks involved especially if their information is exceedingly important.

In response to concerns raised on the other support thread:

1. Google according to this update on 30 March 2020 are not going to be getting rid of this anytime soon. Agreed, it may be argued to be less secure than '0auth,' however apple still advocates "App Passwords" as this link shows from Jan 2020.
2. There's no need to manually configure server settings
3. Agreed, the inability to sync calendars and contacts will be a no go for some.

I am happy to use this as an interim solution until Apple comes up with a long-term fix. Personally, I'm not too concerned with the "security" of this fix as both Apple and Google still have the settings available to generate an App Password from their security settings pages. Also, I suspect a large proportion of multiple Gmail account users have not activated 2FA on their accounts yet, which is a greater security risk than an App Password anyway!

Thanks once again for bringing this info over.

EIM

Thanks EIM

Well, I've done it and it works, and after 6 months of having my (numbered!) mailboxes out of order it's a relief. My "workflow" has been organised this way since 2014, it worked for me. Catalina broke it and although I agree with the poster who says it is Apple's job to fix bugs, on this occasion I am glad to have beaten them to it (it's been a long time). I don't use Google calendars or contacts, and having now activated 2FA I feel more secure than I did before.

So on balance I think it was a good thing to try, fingers crossed for the future and thank you for pointing us towards a solution.

John

I’m actually surprised that works because early in in an effort to figure out the problem I removed all accounts, adding back slowly to see if perhaps one account was the source of the problem. Well the first two added had the security settings you described. Shuffling commenced soon afterwards regardless.

a few months later - I have the same issue here. Its not daily, it could just happen during the use of mail. Strange enough it is the inbox, it is not sorting the detail directories of the mailboxes below.

Hi. I have watched this thread for a while now.

I have been having the exact same problem. But I reordered my inbox once again a few days ago and it has remained the same ever since. I have done nothing at all except I did upgrade to Catalina 10.5.5

I wonder did they fix this?

I reported it too - months ago. Clearly from this thread many have.

Does not engender confidence that 'this did not appear to be a known issue for them".

If I had to guess (pure guess) I would say they are already phasing out some aspect of this interface and deep in the bowels of the spaceship campus - they feel it's not worth their time.

maybe 🤷‍♂️