MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise

BeatnikMoon wrote:

The issue is we have taken it up with Apple directly, even having a call with a regional Business Team manager. We were told that our issues would be escalated and that they would take care of it. But that's as far as it's gone -- we've had no other updates from anyone. Therefore, these forums are another step in making sure Apple is aware of what's going on.

The thing is, you did have the meeting with Apple and this forum is not a good way of "making sure Apple is aware" of anything.

The other thing is sadly, you just need to be patient as that's how Apple has always worked - they collect data from you and you don't hear anything more until someday it is fixed or a repair program is rolled out.

Also, if they don't then who moderates comments? My original reply was moderated for discussing what our next steps are. Also, it doesn't explain why our CEO, who started this thread, got banned for a week.

Apple only reads these forums to enforce compliance with the Apple Support Communities Terms of Use, not for support reasons (though there are Community Leaders who will chime in with solutions to simple issues.) If Apple development engineers reach out to you due to comments posted here it's only because they read the forum on their own time, not as part of their job.

Your CEO had posts removed and was given a timeout for repeated violations of the Terms of Use that you, I, and everyone else posting here had to agree to follow when creating an account.

BeatnikMoon wrote:

I understand they don't offer support through here. My reply wasn't to ask for support, but it WAS to support the issues we're seeing. But would it really hurt for someone, in some capacity, to say "we hear you, and we're actively looking into this issue", even if it was on their own time? It wouldn't even have to be that specific! Just a "we know this thread is going on" would probably be enough for most posters.

Simply put, Apple does not do that and never has. I don't know why, but you can Google Tim Cook's email address and perhaps he or someone on his staff will give you an answer.

Remember these forums exist to allow Apple users to help other Apple users with technical issues; you have has much access to Apple's rationales as those of us who've been here for over a decade.

I get you're passionate about Apple products. I am as well -- been an active user of virtually everything for a decade. What I don't understand is the "need to be patient" explanation and the lack of any communication. This thread was started 5 months ago, and has been viewed and responded to by a ton of people (way more than the stats show) seeing similar problems. I think we've all been MORE than patient.

I'm just explaining how Apple works; being petulant and indignant won't get them to respond any more than being all sweetness and light would.

Fact is, they don't respond here, and no amount of sunshine, vitriol or anything in between is going to change that.

Those of us who have, once again, been here forever only want to point that out so that you're not overly disappointed when the response you desire never comes.

Apple will respond by fixing the issue if it's software, offering a repair program if it's hardware and units are out of warranty, or not at all if the product is actually operating as designed.

Note I'm talking about the fan/heat issue, not the corrupted graphics issues which are clearly issues that should be handled directly on a machine by machine basis through Apple Support.

BeatnikMoon wrote:

Having had forums in one form or another in the the last 3 businesses I worked for, one of which I helped start, I can tell you we had people review forum posts, answered people's questions and escalate issues mentioned in there -- and let people know we saw the issues, were working on fixes, and then had fixes ready for release -- even if we didn't use the forums/communities as official support channels. It didn't matter if we had millions of users or thousands, if it was during work hours or on our own time. It is just good customer service.

That's because you used your forums as at least unofficial support channels and as a way for your company to interact with your customers.

Apple provides these forums only for users to help each other. That's it, period.

Apple Support is done only through, well, Apple Support.

For completeness, an update having just received a TB3 to DP cable. In short, no improvement.

To recap, I have now tried every combination I can think of, all of which produce the same result:

internal monitor + external monitor = 20 W GPU consumption + excessive heat + fan noise.

I have tried:

• Internal monitor only = 6 W
• External 4k 60 Hz monitor + closed clamshell = 6 W
• Internal + 4k 60 Hz direct connected with USB-C to HDMI 2.0 cable = 20 W
• Internal + 4k 60 Hz connected via CalDigit TS3+ with DP cable = 20 W
• Internal + 4k 60 Hz direct connected with TB3 to DP cable = 20 W

Unfortunately, I'm not in a position to test higher than 60 Hz refresh rates as my monitor supports 60 Hz max.

I attach a screenshot of the most recent test below. I would really appreciate it if any forum members have a different result to post an equivalent screenshot. This will help us figure out whether this is a systematic software issue or a sporadic (albeit common) hardware fault for which a return might help.

I think we can also put to bed the idea that "legacy" interfaces behave any differently to DP interfaces.

ntompson wrote:

For completeness, an update having just received a TB3 to DP cable. In short, no improvement.

To recap, I have now tried every combination I can think of, all of which produce the same result:

internal monitor + external monitor = 20 W GPU consumption + excessive heat + fan noise.

•

I have tried:

Internal monitor only = 6 W

• External 4k 60 Hz monitor + closed clamshell = 6 W

• Internal + 4k 60 Hz direct connected with USB-C to HDMI 2.0 cable = 20 W

• Internal + 4k 60 Hz connected via CalDigit TS3+ with DP cable = 20 W

• Internal + 4k 60 Hz direct connected with TB3 to DP cable = 20 W

...

I think we can also put to bed the idea that "legacy" interfaces behave any differently to DP interfaces.

The data point missing to clinch that argument --

(that "legacy" or "heartbeat refresh" as some prefer to call them) behave no differently --

is to connect your External display using an HDMI cable and turn off the Internal by closing the clamshell.

Your 2 March report of 20W (linked below) did not specify whether you had turned off the Internal display:

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/250878229?answerId=252216752022#252216752022

.

I bought a new MacBook Pro 3 days ago (i9 2.4GHz, 64GB RAM, 8GB GPU) and the new Dell U2720Q (4K, 3840x2160 60Hz). MacBook is connected to display with USB-C (and is also charged through the same cable). I am experiencing the same issues as reported - macbook is noticeably warmer when lid is open, this is also confirmed with iStat Menu (+ 20C with open lid). Closing the lid solves this, but this has other issues -> microphone is disconnected (that's a HW feature of T2 chip), touch-id not and webcamera accessible (I will need to open the lid for every remote meeting).

I personally see this as a defect or bad design.

Also as a side note, I was also greeted with a kernel panic crash during sleep on second day on my super expensive macbook (a well known issue of the 16" - it happens regurarly if you schedule lot of work, for example iCloud sync and then put the notebook to sleep: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251223766)

Comments are deleted by the moderators only because they violate the Apple

Support Communities Terms of Use, which everyone agreed to follow when they created a login:

Apple Support Communities Use Agreement - Apple Community

TailsDog wrote:

I posted a link to an article about this the other day and it was removed. It's a bit random how some stuff gets removed and some stays.

Not at all; posts get removed only if they violate the Apple Support Communities Terms of Use.

wealthandnecessity wrote:

And it looks like they banned the OP for no reason too for a while who was a major contributor to this thread.

People only get "banned" for repeatedly violating, after receiving multiple warnings, the Terms of Use he and everyone else here agreed to follow to post to the Apple Support Communities.

Apple Support Communities Use Agreement - Apple Community

TimUzzanti wrote:

Having started this thread 5 months ago, and attempting to work with a variety of teams at Apple -- all of which apparently had no ability to do anything -- as well as my employees working directly with Apple Engineers that we contacted (or who contacted us) we're no closer to a solution. We've seen no results and in most cases the engineers who we have been in contact with have stopped responding to us. We haven't even gotten an acknowledgement of the problem.

You have been told repeatedly by multiple contributors that Apple does not "acknowledge" issues and that Apple Engineers as a rule do not get back into contact after receiving the data they had requested from you (and the fact that they also read these boards, if they do so, on their own time, not as part of their jobs.)

To be honest, the last straw was being banned on this community for a week while this thread had been constantly derailed by moderators. I'm the CEO of multiple companies with many employees and spend significant amount of money on IT procurement for our own companies as well for an MSP. For a company to have a policy to not acknowledge an issue and a moderator team willing to use that as an answer blows my mind. That is not a company we can work with and not how we run our companies.

You had multiple posts removed for violating the Apple Support Communities Terms of Use, you were warned of what would happen if you continued to do so, and… you continued to do so.

Moderators don't care about your posts, they only care if you are violating the Terms of Use… which you willingly and repeatedly did.

If it "blows your mind" that a company that does not acknowledge issues in public dared to… not acknowledge your issues in public, so be it. Good luck with whatever vendor you decide to go with next, as no PC maker acknowledges issues in public, either, so I'm not sure where you will turn. Certainly I know people who spend eight figures or more per year with Dell, HP and Lenovo who have never had any of them "acknowledge an issue" with their systems.

Best of luck in your future with whatever solution you choose.

I think that it's time to move on to a new thread: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251329522

There is a lot of misinformation, and the title "Fan Noise" is too general. We have to keep talking about the specific issue, which is the high GPU power consumption with an external monitor, while the lid is open.

I posted here some information that may help you all to understand what the problem is all about: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251329522. I also added a comment with some results, after many tests that I've done.

If you have the same problem feel free to share it there. Contribute there your thoughts, and any information that you've got from Apple support and engineers.

I stand corrected, based on your comments and this Apple article:

If you want to use the higher-performance discrete graphics processor at all times, choose Apple menu > System Preferences and click Energy Saver. Then deselect the automatic graphics switching checkbox.

Set graphics performance on MacBook Pro - Apple Support

so that Energy-Saver setting could also be called "use Integrated graphics when possible"

I know that this thread is getting long, so I will try to stick to the point.

This is not a solution. I am presenting my observations when using it with an external 4K monitor, and it is intended for those of us who decided to stick with their 16-inch and live with it for the time being, and just want to hear how others are doing.

My setup:

MacBookPro (16-inch, 2019) / 2.6GHz 6-Core Intel Core i7 / 32GB RAM / AMD Radeon Pro 5300M 4GB

External 4K monitor (LG 27UD68-P)

The resolution of the MBP is set to Looks like 1536 x 960.

The resolution of the external monitor is set to Looks like 1920 x 1080.

Connection: 3rd party USB-C to DisplayPort cable on the left side of the MBP (more on this later)

(I also have a USB-C to HDMI adapter but it didn't make a noticeable difference.)

We all know that many of our MBP exhibits this behavior where the RPM of the fans tend to increase (and the GPU uses more watts) when using it with an external monitor, unless used in clamshell mode.

The following graph from iStat shows the speed of my MBP's left fan under different conditions, when using both the internal monitor and an external 4K monitor.

While it is pretty self-explanatory, I want to point out the following observations:

• When the MBP is idle (the flat slope right before [2] in the image), the fans spin at about 2300RPM, and personally I think that this is acceptable.
• Even when doing light web browsing, it is under 3000RPM.
• Watching a Youtube video (the Hermitage video on Apple's channel) at point [5] increases the fan speed but then it starts to stabilize at around 3300RPM (subjectively speaking, this is when I start to notice the sound of the fans).

I also used FCPX and observed that:

• When editing/playing back footage, the fans spin at about 3000~4000RPM.
• When analyzing/exporting footage, the fans spin at about 4000~5000RPM.
• If I do the same things in clamshell mode, these speeds are roughly reduced by 1000RPM.
• However, the task of analyzing/exporting a video footage is a computationally expensive task, and it will nevertheless hit 5000RPM even in clamshell mode.

Lastly, I want to point out that, at least in my setup, plugging the monitor cable on the left side of the MBP reduced the fan speed by roughly 400RPM compared to plugging it on the right side. This is independent of where the charging cable is being used.

I am attaching the sensor readings from iStat in case anyone wants to compare it with their own.

This is at point [2] in the previous image, where the system was pretty much idle.

If you have any questions, please let me know.

Connect more than two DVI or HDMI displays

Mac Pro supports a total of two DVI or HDMI displays when connected via the built-in HDMI port or using the Apple Mini DisplayPort to DVI adapter. To connect additional DVI displays, use an active DVI adapter like the Apple Mini DisplayPort to Dual-Link DVI adapter. You can connect up to six active adapter DVI displays. This requires a powered USB hub since Mac Pro offers four USB ports and you need six USB ports to connect the Dual-Link DVI adapters.

from:

Use multiple displays with your Mac Pro (Late 2013) - Apple Support

.