You can make a difference in the Apple Support Community!

When you sign up with your Apple Account, you can provide valuable feedback to other community members by upvoting helpful replies and User Tips.

Looks like no one’s replied in a while. To start the conversation again, simply ask a new question.

16-inch MacBook Pro Bluetooth issue

I bought the new 16-inch MacBook Pro when it first came out and was happily using it until a week later my bluetooth stopped discovering devices, in particular my Magic Mouse and iPhone. I tried everything from resetting nvram, smc, resetting the bluetooth module, removing bluetooth.plist, downloaded bluetooth explorer and reset a bunch of settings etc and even went to the extent of completely formatting the computer and installing osx from scratch to no avail. Hardware diagnostics showed no hardware issues as well. The bluetooth device was showing up fine in System Report but it just wasn't discovering anything. I have a work laptop (2017 MacBook Pro) which I use side by side and it was working fine.


Long story short, I was able to replace the device at the Apple store I bought it at since it was within the 14 day return policy window. So I put it down to just being unlucky.


It's been a few weeks since then and I now have the same issue with the replacement laptop. This time though I think I know what triggered it.


I have a CalDigit dock that I use for my work laptop and occasionally have a usb bluetooth device attached to it for some work I do in virtual machines. The issue occurred when I connected my new MacBook to the dock along with the bluetooth dongle. The usb bluetooth dongle worked fine however when I disconnected the thunderbolt dock from the MacBook I noticed the bluetooth icon in the top right hand corner changed to an icon with a zigzag across it, obviously due to bluetooth device being disconnected.


Since disconnecting the external bluetooth device I'm having the same issue as I had previously, my MacBook Bluetooth device won't find any devices and is not recognized by other bluetooth devices like my iPhone/other MacBooks. I've gone through the whole process as before, and have resorted to a clean install of osx to no avail. I've even compared bluetoothd console logs between the working MacBook I have and the now broken one, the only difference is the working MacBook is able to detect devices when they are advertised, whereas the MacBook Pro 16-inch does not.


Digging into this, it seems as though OSX by default switches to any attached USB bluetooth device when it's plugged in and then when disconnected, it reverts back to the onboard device. This works fine on my old MacBook as I've been using the USB dongle for a while now without any issues. I initially thought that there may be a software issue with the internal bluetooth device not switching back properly but I would have thought a clean install would have fixed it so there must be some sort of hardware issue specifically with the new MacBook Pro 16-inch.


I'm pretty frustrated now as I've now gone through two 16-inch MacBook Pro's with bricked bluetooth devices that I'm fairly certain was caused by connecting an external bluetooth dongle via thunderbolt. I'm pretty sure onboard devices shouldn't die just because a third party device was connected/disconnected.


Has anyone come across this yet with the new MacBook Pro 16-inch? I'm going to visit the Apple store tomorrow to see what they can do but I'd prefer if I didn't have to send my laptop away and just find a fix myself if there is one. If not, I thought it'd be good to post my experience here in case anyone else comes across this.

MacBook Pro 16", macOS 10.15

Posted on Dec 14, 2019 2:09 AM

Reply
Question marked as Top-ranking reply

Posted on Jul 6, 2020 5:25 AM

Here is a summary of the whole thread:


TL;DR:


  • It's apparently possible to unfix the problem with a BT 2.0 dongle
  • For those that are scared to break it again (after logic board replacement OR BT 2.0 fix), they can run a NVRAM command to never switch BT controllers again (need to re-run after NVRAM reset):


sudo nvram bluetoothHostControllerSwitchBehavior="never"


Might be best to put that in a startup script and only change if needed.


  • It seems to have to do with Power Management and seemingly a EFI firmware bug introduced in Catalina as it's not possible to break Mojave in the same way.


So in summary it's several factors that came together here to create this bug:


  • a) A likely firmware bug in the EFI in Catalina.
  • b) A pretty unsafe default for switching Bluetooth controllers - which most users likely don't want anyway.
  • c) Maybe: A CSR USB controller using the exact same chip as the internal one. (if I am able to unbreak my device, I will try to re-break with a Broadcom 4.0 device, too)


Long version:


I have been bitten by the Bluetooth bug, too that breaks the internal Bluetooth module on Mac Book Pro 16inch if you accidentally plug in an USB CSR 4.0 Bluetooth dongle.


  • It seems to not happen on Mojave - so it's also related to a driver bug in Catalina regarding power management.
  • It happens in the first place because the nvram default behavior is to switch over to external Bluetooth by default.


The symptom is:


  • The Bluetooth chip gets too little power and hence fails to connect to devices and if it does connection is spotty. While on MacBook Pro 16inch it completely fails, other Macs can have bad Bluetooth behavior that is "spotty".


  • The solution of AppleRepair so far has been to completely replace the logic board, which fixes it till the next Dongle is plugged in and obviously is quite costly for a pure software bug.


Several observations:


  • The current theory is that the internal firmware mixes up the external CSR chip for it's own and saves the power requirement of the external chip (which is less as its powered by BT) and then uses this for the internal chip.


  • a) It is highly debatable to make the switch over to external dongle the default for all users if the functionality is usually only wanted by a handful of developers that develop Bluetooth LE applications. In fact it also breaks it for iOS developers and everyone that wants to use a Dongle to use with a VM:



  • Fortunately that is easily remedied with a nvram command to change the behavior. It would be great if Apple changed this in the next minor Catalina release by default to not switch over to external Bluetooth automatically, but make it an option to select the Controller (like you can do with Bluetooth Explorer). The setting could be stored and automatically be applied after every reboot to what the user configured. That would prevent the bug in probably most user cases until a proper fix can be found.


  • b) It is unclear if a pure software fix could fix this as per the reports the issue remains once it has happened even if you boot into Windows / Bootcamp. However it is seemingly possible (per the above accepted answer) to unfix that issue with an older CSR Bluetooth 2.0 dongle. This probably helps, because it has a different power requirement as it predates Bluetooth LE and hence the MacBook FW gives the internal Bluetooth chip more power again.


  • c) Someone tried to port the Bluetooth drivers from Catalina to Mojave and it did not work.This points to the fact that it likely is an EFI / soft FW update that broke this in Catalina and not a pure software bug.


Overall it seems Apple would have several ways to fix / work around this:


  • Fix the EFI to fix the PM bug. (that gives hope that it can be fixed 100% and also restored affected devices without logic board replacement)
  • If that fix takes a while to do, at least change the default and put out a changelog for those few that need to use an external Bluetooth dongle to replace the internal one.
  • Create a program that does whatever the diagnostics on the Apple Wifi in the repair shop does to reset the firmware to sane values.
  • Create a device to emulate the USB behavior of a 2.0 Bluetooth device to fix broken devices [unlikely as that is].


In theory VirtualHere + ZeroTier could be used to share a BT 2.0 dongle from one machine on the internet to another one and unbreak something remotely. (not sure if that would work in practice though as emulation is not perfect. Though I know that Bluetooth over Internet works well as that is ironically how I broke my BT in the first place as I needed a dongle for bluetooth-over-internet)

Similar questions

341 replies

Apr 4, 2020 8:49 AM in response to codehoser

Yes no problem

The adapter im using is

https://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B00LSGUBLI/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

plus it has a CSR8510 Chipset like @vitorhenrique


Simply a joke and not a reason for me not to plug such a device in...

within 3 fixed here in germany they have to take the device back!

Never heard such problems - not to plug in a specific usb adapter LOL

How could any noobie know this? Simply not possible...



Apr 9, 2020 11:16 AM in response to jberian

@jberian


I had my bluetooth adapter connected on the side of Sennheiser SDW-5000 which then connected to the CalDigit hub via USB.


I just had the laptop returned from Apple. Never connecting a bluetooth adapter again till hear otherwise from Apple.


I saw Catalina got 10.15.4 update today, and didn't see anything about Bluetooth on the release notes.


Conrad

Apr 10, 2020 6:35 AM in response to christospappas

I can also confirm that this is the case.


I share a monitor with my stationary computer. I recently got my self a bluetooth dongle to use with my home computer, its plugged in to the dell monitor and after i connected my mac to it. I haven't been able to connect any bluetooth devices back onto the MacBook 2019 16" using the internal bluetooth.


Im not very tempted to deliver my computer in for repair in these corona times :P


Hope it's possible to patch this problem somehow. I cant understand how a dongle is suppose to destroy the internal bluetooth receiver/transmitter.


I've also tried to use the bluetooth explorer to debug the bluetooth device, this has gotten me this error:

"updateChainPower error: -3903

2020-04-10 13:11:13 +0000 Apple80211Get(APPLE80211_IOC_BTCOEX_MODE) returned error -3903"

Apr 11, 2020 2:45 AM in response to hairdresser06

Got mine back in 3 days at a official repair point, should never take 4 weeks!


Trust me, just got mine back from the repair point and the replaced the whole board just like others explained here. The internal BT just doesn't work and they have to replace the whole board, just do it under warranty and your all good to go after a few days/weeks.


Make sure to never plugin a BT dongle again :)

Apr 12, 2020 5:22 PM in response to christospappas

Both wifi and bluetooth failed on me. As with others, I am using dongles. I asked Apple for repair but they insisted I ship it in rather than do it at the store.


I am teacher, currently trying to carry-on distance learning. Being without my mac for a week or more is impossible. I had hoped they would swap out the Macs, I even offered to pay something for it, but no dice.


All my experience with Macs (I have owned one since 1984) has always been good until this time. I had this Mac for barely 3 months. I really feel like this company has lost its soul.

Apr 13, 2020 10:30 AM in response to jdharris56

Like I mentioned before @jdharris56 i`m a windows guy and i bought the mac for my surface book and this was for sure the last mac I own.

Here, in germany, the said on chat twice that I cant send it it in and I should bring to a store nearby me...then they look up and found out that the next store is roughly 110 kilometer (about 160 US miles ) from my home PLUS due to corona virus I cant drive there because of the quarantine.

So what is the solution ? Sit there and wait til I can drive there 2 times to bring and pick it up? Who pays me for this? Never experienced such a bad service...

Best thing is - what happens when it is repaired? I always have to be scared that I forget to pull my BT receiver from my dock ..otherwise this thing blows up again? Pretty cool solution as far as you ask me. I really would like to go to the store and when I pick it up i will again attach my BT dongle there and let it blow up again...really. Here in germany if the same error occurs 3 times in a row and It cant get fixed you have to get your money back...thats what the law here says.

Maybe the best solution because not attaching a dongle anymore is really crap - because I know it will happen again.

Apr 18, 2020 10:47 PM in response to aLegend2k

aLegend2k wrote:

Here in germany if the same error occurs 3 times in a row and It cant get fixed you have to get your money back...thats what the law here says.

US has similar 'Lemon' laws.

Maybe the best solution because not attaching a dongle anymore is really crap - because I know it will happen again.

Issues related to power (mis)management and thermal overload, bad chip packaging have dogged Apple for a long time.

May 19, 2020 5:08 AM in response to jjcinaz

jjcinaz wrote:

You’d think the people at the repair depots would be noticing the frequency of problems.

There is a Repair Frequency Index by year/Mac model/manufacturing location/serial number/replaced part serial number and type. 😉 Repeat Repair Index tracks the number of times a given serial number comes back for warranty repairs.


There is a very unhappy bunch of engineers and managers somewhere on this planet. And this is not the first time!

May 19, 2020 9:31 AM in response to christospappas

I just got the same issue, I am using razor x chroma as for thunderbolt, I have tried all and plus even wasting time with apple care, format the computer, installed bootcamp too for windows 10. Over there the same ble is not working either after the issue. This sucks big time. Now they want to fix the computer, but it seems more likely another bad step from apple engineering. For me when doing the check up (D) it telling me all is good but obviously it is not working.


what did you do at the end?

May 19, 2020 10:00 AM in response to Dalogan72

Dalogan72 wrote:

I hope they find a solution but I really doubt that, money has been spent already they don’t care anymore.

After 2010, I only bought refurbished Macs. The only exception has been a 2018 Mini. My experience has been to wait for at least a year after a new model is released, before I consider a purchase. The 15-in line-up is a much more stable lineup.

16-inch MacBook Pro Bluetooth issue

Welcome to Apple Support Community
A forum where Apple customers help each other with their products. Get started with your Apple Account.