Logic 7.2.......Well I guess no posts = good news :-)

By Mattrixx :
"As far as the 'Instrument Drop out' bug is concerned.
Maybe it is not easily reproduced. I cannot get it to
occur. I personally don't know anyone else that can
also.
Which instruments does this happen with? And under
what circumstances?"


You know what...Thats a good question cos i dont seam to understand what they are talking about wen they talk about 'Instrument Drop out'.



2xG5 2ghz/1 powerbook 15 1ghz/1 G4 933/Motu HD192 Mac OS X (10.4.4)

Which instruments does this happen with? And under what circumstances?

Any and at completely random times. I don't use logic very much and it has happened to me several times.

There are still annoying little things that haven't been fixed, but there are always workarounds.

There is NO work around for the inability to import XML OMF or AAF session information from Final Cut Pro. That isn't an "annoying little thing" it is a show stopper bug that keeps me from using it for scoring and audio post production.

It is going theough a transitional phase, but it does not stop me from working!

Well it's been a two year transition for me. Your viewpoint is a little narrow regarding the applications function. If a little loop bug is all that you are talking about I am with you but I bought Logic before it even had looping capability and the importing functions still have not been fixed,

BUT you can import grarageband sessions!

I am sure that if they had put as much effort into making XML or OMF importing work as the did into rolling Garageband importing or Looping into the program it would be working by now.

After all XML OMF and AFF importing is an advertised feature! It just doesn't work! As a matter of fact they develooped the entire Soundtrack Pro application and still haven't fixed that MAJOR flaw in Logic Pro.

So I am glad your looping bug is so simple. I imagine they could have held up release for a while and gotten it fixed for you if they thought it was important.

So if you are just having fun writing music and if upon output having automation randomly not being applied to a mix doesn't bother you and you don't need to import production audio into your DAW to perform audio post production and scoring and you don't use the score editor for ooutputting scores for movies and you don't need to write music to tracks that change Tempo to a 45 minute show etc. etc. then I guess you can accept the looping bug as a minor irratation.

There are users and there are users.

Matrixx wrote: "There are still annoying little things that haven't been fixed, but there are always workarounds."

There is no rule, theory, or practice of computing that I'm aware of which says "every bug has a workaround". If that were the case, there would be no bugs. But all you have to do is look a little more carefully in this very forum to find people, like myself, who sometimes find that Logic's bugs seriously impede -- and sometimes destroy -- their work.

Everyone works with Logic in a different way. So it's entirely possible that the few bugs or errant behavior you've discovered have workarounds. And good for you! It means you can work without the program hindering your progress too much.

But other people, who use Logic differently from you, or who regularly use and depend on features that you may not use, have discovered various bugs which have no workarounds. My personal favorite is when Logic crashes upon quitting. I guess the workaround for that is not to quit Logic? 😉

1. When an instrument drops out, save the song.

2. Click on File/Revert to saved. If it's greyed out, just briefly run the song or change something until it's available. Then click on it. This will load the song you just saved, but with all instruments working again. As long as you have 'Keep common samples in memory when switching songs' checked under 'options' on the EXS24 interface (under 'Preferences') the instruments do not have to load again and the song will be ready immediately.
This takes a very short time. No need to close song or reboot Logic.



good one, michael. maximum points to you for the first practical and helpful post on this topic. nice one.

as for the 'just d*mn fix it already!' crowd:

I've said this before on this topic.. bugs can range from being an obvious boo boo in some code or some conflict that gets missed in testing, easily rectified when found, much like fixing a typo when you proofread.
others, unfortunately, are heinously difficult to isolate, and this one has all the hallmarks of being one of the worst in this category. just look at the range of users that have experienced the problem, and then other power-users like blumpy who work day in day out and have never ever seen it, ever.
you gotta find the bug before you can squish it. and given that it could come from a random convergence of seemingly unrelated factors, it's not hard to imagine that the causes for this one are totally elusive and sneaky to find.

anyway, still it's no excuse after this long, and I for one hope that a beta testing team still does exist out there, somewhere.... and that they are sending debugger reports whenever this prob shows up.

I agree that it's great that Michael has presented a workaround that works for him. Personally I don't think this is an acceptable workaround, but in all fairness, at least a workaround exists.

I also agree with your assessment that some bugs are extremely difficult to fix. But I can't help but wonder why this bug is taking YEARS to fix! Its continued existence starts to appear to be a bit absurd when new features are added while long-standing bugs are left to reside in the code.

Now as a former programmer myself I've certainly had more fun adding new features to my programs than I have had in facing the "to do" list of known issues and bugs in older parts of the code. But were I to have had the inclination to market my software, certainly I would've been fooling myself to think that end-users would be as tolerant of the bugs as I was.

You wrote: you gotta find the bug before you can squish it. As I see it, there's plenty of opportunity for Logic's programmers to gather test examples. All they'd have to do is follow some of these threads, contact the users who are experiencing the problem and request copies of .lso files that expresses the SIDS behavior. Word travels quickly in these fora. If it was known that programmers were looking for examples, they'd be coming out of the woodwork.

And in the process there would be ample opportunity to gather information about the OS, computer model, audio interface, MIDI interface, and 3rd party apps from each end user. Comparing notes and seeing if a pattern emerges between "gear sets" may prove illuminating as well (programmers, as you know, are typically good at seeing patterns in things).

But unless this kind of communication between developer and end user is fostered, of course it's going to take forever to isolate the problem.

you makes some good points there about the length of time it takes and the willingness of the logic development team to tackle SIDS.

those that they say that SIDS is a very difficult bug to isolate have a point too. for some of us SIDS isn't as big an issue as it is for others. no doubt it should have been sorted by now.

the very least they can do is say "hey we're really sorry, we're trying to fix this problem but it's got us stumped." you would get the feeling that they were batting for us, on our side and part of the family. the nay-sayers would shouted down by the rest of us saying "come on. this is a tough one, they're doing their best."

but to be honest, we can get bogged down with that when there are so many other pressing bugs that justify the current indignation going around. these are absoutely verfiable, easy to reproduce, regardless of system setups, and some have been around even longer than SIDS. surely these should have priority.

and as blearyeyes pointed out, advertised features should work as advertised. what do you think would happen to a car company that was selling a V8 turbocharged, intercooled engine in their top of the line car, when the customers noticed that the turbocharger doesn't work and the intercooler doesn't exist!

i would rather apple throw their hands up at problems that are really hard to pin down and at least fix the ones that are, rather than just ignoring it altogether.

which of course i know they're not. they have prioritised porting the programme to intel. not very helpful to existing users is it? maybe we'll look back in a few years when we're all happily running a bug free logic on intel machines and wonder what the fuss was about. if there's any of us left by then.

There are users and there are users?!! That has got to be the most narrow minded statement I have heard. I have been using Logic since version 1.06 and dont feel the frustration that you do.
I also work with vision, tempo changes, xml, omf and other data formats that dont work seamlessly in Logic, but, I will state again...... It does NOT stop me from working.
If you are that upset with things, you should be looking at alternative software. All the best!

Its a fact that to find out why a bug / crash occurs it needs to be able to be reproduced to troubleshoot it.

However if the app was run in debug mode they could catch the bug very easily when it occurred (SIDS at least 3 times a day for me which is a real pain in the proverbial)

The exs workarround for keeping samples in memory is a veru good one. Although it doesnt work when you have a BIG **** OFF Ewqlso session going! that can take ages to reload.

What i am now wondering is that apple / emagic know about this bug, have caught it in the debug machine / build but found that it has too many implications to fix.

Does make you wonder....

I don't think it is that simple.
Apple needs a good beta tester program.

Going back to the main point of this thread.....having been a 10.3.9 holdover I finally made the switch today to 10.4.4 AND Logic 7.2 in one fell swoop! So far so good....:) No problems yet....touch wood...! I downloaded the latest drivers for my interfaces and installed them before installing Logic.

man, i believe this software is totally beyond any reasonable repair. I've been sending apple/Emagic bug lists since they went OS X and there are still more than 75 % of those bugs in 7.2....The code is anxient. We are watching the slow downfall of a once giant.

LOL, thought that's what you meant! 😉