iOS 10.1 Battery drain

paikinator wrote:

You would only have a 90-day warranty on the battery if your phone's warranty had less than 90 days left on it or was out of warranty entirely.

I would assume a 3 year old 5S with a battery that was installed 3 months ago would be bumping up against its warranty of 90 days which is why I advised urgency in seeking help with the 5S battery issue and having Apple run a diagnostic.

It's good advice to deal with issues sooner rather than later. I simply wanted to clarify that there are times when a battery has a warranty longer than 90 days. I'm a proponent of precision in a technical support forum.

iPhone outside warranty: 90 Days battery warranty

iPhone with warranty: min 90 days, up to whichever is longer (e.g. Apple Care 2nd year).

CC: doubles manufacturer, so 90 days more for a total of 180 claimable with your CC and a certified Defect report.

back to school work...

*Addition/correction that hit me*

Stating the "original" battery was dated 2/14. It hit me I've had the phone much longer. Had the 5 since it came out upgrading from the 3g. Apple replaced the battery when I took it in (45 min drive) for the power button recall. So technically the 2nd battery, not original to the phone but still replaced by Apple. Just a wording catch.

i just want to express my frustration with my iPhone 6 which like many others had the battery life suddenly tank and random shutdowns.

Before I was aware others were having this issue, I made a genius bar appt. They checked my phone and told me everything was ok, but just in case they recommended a complete restore which they did. I was told everything would be ok.

Nothing changed. I explored this community and found that others were having the same problem. I scheduled a telephone apple support call and they assessed my phone again and again I received the good news that my phone was fine. The only solution that was offered was to switch my phone to low power mode. I asked about other's experiences and was told that only a small number of iPhone 6s were having battery problems. I asked if a new battery would solve my problem and was told that Apple did not recommend a battery change since my battery was tested at 86% of capacity. Apple support was very clear that a battery change would be at my expence and risk.

I Decided to accept the risk and expense and scheduled another Genius Bar appt to get a battery installed. At the appointment they did not have the battery in stock, but they checked my phone again with the results that my phone and battery is good. Now I'm waiting for a call to be notified they have the battery In stock so I can see if this will fix my phone.

So I'm frustrated that I don't have a phone that I can trust.

I'm frustrated that if there is an iOS issue, Apple has made no comment on any possible connection with iOS 10.x and the problems that I'm experiencing. Other than speculation on this community board that iOS 10.2 includes something to check battery drain and iOS 10.3 may have a fix, I have not found anything from apple (and the support call and the last Genius Bar appointment denied any known problem)

If this is simply an lithium battery issue, then I'm frustrated that after 2 Genius Bar appointments and one support call, Apple assesses my battery and phone as being fine. If we should expect that batteries in iPhones may go bad at anytime if you use the flashlight, or if your phone gets hot or cold or if you use certain apps, then why doesn't Apple design it with a user replaceable battery.

Two Assumption. First, that it is the OS. A patch may fix. it.

Assumption 2, that it is the battery:

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/testing_lithium_based_batteries is your starting point. And will quote from there:

"No rapid-test can evaluate all battery symptoms and there are always outliers that defy the test protocol. Correct prediction should be 9 out of 10. QuickSort™ (by Cadex) exceeds this requirement with most Li-ion packs for mobile phones, but this technology only testes single-cell packs up to 1,500mAh. New technologies in development promise to test larger Li-ion packs, but this may extend the test to a few minutes to accommodate low frequency sampling."

https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=0ahUKEwjCl4ze 1KfRAhXI1IMKHQrVAtIQFggpMAI&url=http%3A%…

"QuickSort™ is based on the electrochemical dynamic response of the battery rather than resistance measurement.

Resistance does not provide a reliable indication on capacity fade that occurs with cycling."

All quick health readouts are resistance tests. In all smartphones, Management Controllers just report the resistance, i.e. capacity retention it is at at that moment. Let's say you have a new, yet defective battery. We know they exist. Yet Apple tests all devices, as do the battery manufacturers, right? A quick first resistance testing, it will read 100-105%. Yet it still is defective. It is meant to die in weeks, or months, but, by specs, according to resistance, it is fine. At 86%, it may still meet the 80% above threshold, but still defective and dying.

Cadex testing is down with batteries removed and they are approaching the 30s threshold. But that is another future measurement metric, not yet an industry standard.

So technically Apple staff is correct when referring to its resistance / capacity /'health' measurement standard, one day Fine at 90%, and, 60 days, later, telling Adrian that his battery Died at 20%. Both answers are correct even if days apart. But the dynamic response of the battery was never measured unless you witness that battery removed and placed on special devices... Onboard diagnostics collect MC data, do not stress a battery across a frequency spectrum.

No, these advanced testing techniques are not possible on a production line. 250 000 000 iPhones (and 300 million other brands) at future 30 s Cadex / per battery test means 125 million testing minutes for iPhone intended batteries alone. It can be done post facto to establish the few million defective units, but not possible before, with current technology. The production line, even with 1000 testing kits, or 100 000, would be too slow....

in other words, your intuition is right, and their response is correct against the reference system they use. The issue is inherent to Li Ion technology, limitations and industrial standards.

All you have to do is wait. If it is the battery, it will die shortly, likely within the Apple Care warranty. Best of possible, use your phone as you would normally. Of course, the more drain it experiences, the quicker its health will degrade to warrant-able status.😉

If we should expect that batteries in iPhones may go bad at anytime if you use the flashlight, or if your phone gets hot or cold or if you use certain apps, then why doesn't Apple design it with a user replaceable battery

Because removable batteries have x5 more ways that they can kill any phone (corrosion, water based shorts, 3d party cheap battery short, etc). If Apple has even 9 million yearly defective units, annually, out of 500 million in use, that is an engineering feat. A removable battery can push them x5 more defective units. As it is you have around 97% odds of perfectly working phone for 2+years..

I can't wait for a complete failure because of my work (medical). Having a fully charged phone silently shut off with minimal use in 5-8 hours is not compatible with being on call for the ER for 24-48 hr shifts.

I can't wait so I'll buy a new battery as soon as possible. If that doesn't fix the problem, I will not be able to wait to see if Apple fixes a software problem if they are silent on whether a problem exists.

If I have to replace this phone, my loyalty to Apple iPhones will not be automatic as it has been since I replaced a blackberry 8-10 yrs ago.

Great, hopefully you will keep us posted after replacing your battery.

Just curious, do you work in a medical center with good cell signal?

I recently had a barely used BB Q10 replaced due to mysterious shutdown issues, could have been battery. I hope you do not compare brands across time. No smartphone today is similar to one designed 12 years ago and released 2-3 years later. Screens were tiny, power demands minimal, hardware potency very limited. Today, all top tier brands have similar reliability rates as they often share known manufacturers. So Company X will be making 200 million top tier NAND chips for top brands A B and C. Company Z would be sourced to make 150 million of the the same chips for A, B and C as X is unable to make more than 200 million. Companies W and V are asked to make 350 million management controllers for X and Z's battery production line. P Q and R are producing 350 million temperature sensors, other companies the 350 million charge state monitors, and someone else the insulating sheets and cathodes. Multiple manufacturers produce common parts. All these get delivered in time for X and Z to put together, and be shipped at the known smartphone assembly plants. A tiny error of 10 000/million could slip undetected.

All lower tier brands (BB) have more failure rates as they order lower grade components.

Same problem here - iPhone 6 dies with 36% battery as soon as it gets slightly chilled in temperatures well above freezing, anything below about 8C. Have all the latest software and had the phone checked at an Apple store - much use that was(nt.) Phone now two years old, problem began this time last winter when a year old. As well as being a safety issue, for an expensive and supposedly top line product this is unacceptable. So, Apple, please do something for you exasperated and long suffering customers as this is clearly not a software issue but a battery one.

I will submit feedback and what happened last winter is I used my phone with a navigation app for hiking and the **** phone would just die in my hand if i had it out of a pocket for more than a few minutes. Similarly if I was making a call longer than a few minutes, the phone simply died. I learned that if I put the phone under my armpit to warm it up for about 5 mins, I could restart it. Same this year, but worse as if I try to warm the phone it comes back on with about 1% battery.

Last winter was relatively warm, so probably the coldest was minus 2 or 3 centigrade, but the shut down happened much warmer than that, and this year the phone has been shutting down at up to plus 7 centigrade. I use the mains electricity charger to recharge, not a car charger

First off, do not feel bad. years ago I used replaced an iPhone 4 battery I used to run in colder temperatures.

Your answer is below at:

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_at_high_and_low_temperatures

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_at_high_and_low_temperatures

Safe temperatures are 10-30 for Li Ion. Below 10 is the low end of the operating chart. Although cold discharge is not as bad as overheat charging, there is a cumulative effect, metallic Lithium plating killing anodes. So let's say you come back with a cold phone and charge it, you are charging a very cold phone (even at 2C) for several minutes before it warms up to room temperature.

The best and only way to use them is chest/skin close, with wired pods (wireless iPods are also battery operated and they will brick). Pull out the phone to press the button and back in. If it is at your core temperature.

Specialized equipment with Li Ion batteries has thermal blankets etc, but cold use equipment does not use Li Ion batteries. There is no battery-safe way to use, discharge or charge outside a Li Ion phone below 5C, no matter the conditions.

About the same here. I don't think our batteries are really being drained though. Today my phone went from a 95% charge to a 1% charge. I plugged it into a charger and within a minute I'm back at a 81% charge. What's going on apple? I'm about to go to android if your programmers can't get their act together!

I am thinking about the same. iPhone, iPad, iwatch.. i am fine with paying a high price for high quality, not talking about most advanced technology or newest features anymore (Apple lost that a while ago). But this is just ridiculous. From 100% to 10% in 3 hours, 2,5 of them in standby mode. Getting worse and worse here. It affects my work...

Apple, solve this issue, we don't care anymore how you do it - just do it!