Kurt Lang wrote:
Without even the slightest doubt, it's a bug. And it's Apple's apps that aren't working the way they should. Using Pages again as an example (latest version), the drop down list doesn't show Noto Sans at all.
But if you open the fonts palette, you suddenly see a bunch of them.
Pages only shows fonts in the fancy menu that are appropriate for your language. If you choose "Show Fonts", then you can see all fonts available on the system, including those for other languages. You can click on the "English" Smart Collection to see the fonts available in English. If your system is running a different language, you will have a different default language smart collection.
Of these, a few have 9 faces (light, medium, etc.) for a total of 32. Which is still well short of the number of Noto Sans fonts that are active.
Those fonts listed in Font book and in the Font display are the only fonts that are active. Apple provides many other fonts for compatibility, but they are not listed in any system font lists. I don't have Adobe apps so I don't know what they are showing. Microsoft Word shows many more Noto fonts, but this is incorrect. Word should not be showing those fonts.
Here is an Apple support document describing how these different font sets work: Fonts included with macOS Catalina - Apple Support
It's pretty clear Apple's apps stink when the drop down menu and font palette of the same app can't even agree what's open.
As far as I can tell, Apple's apps are the only ones doing it correctly.
This is also nothing new with fonts installed by the OS. Athelas.ttc, Iowan Old Style.ttc, Marion.ttc, Seravek.ttc and SuperClarendon.ttc still appear everywhere – except in Apple's own products. Office, Adobe, you name it. Any third party app displays these active fonts. But you cannot find them in any app written by Apple. Not Font Book, Pages, or anything else.
Because Apple's products are the only ones doing it correctly.
There is only one fix for this. Copy these same fonts from (specifically) Yosemite and replace the versions installed by any later version of macOS. Then they show everywhere, as they should.
That's a hack, not a fix. I thought people were upset because they were seeing all these new fonts. I don't see how adding even more fonts would be a fix for that.
Deal with what? That their apps are working correctly?! An active font should be available in every app. Period. There's no wiggle room here, or the slightest reason to throw the blame anywhere other than where it belongs. And that's Apple's crummy apps.
Apple seems to see things differently. Some fonts are designed specifically for Asian languages that have much different character sets than English. There is no point in making them available for English. I happen to agree with Apple.
I've been paying attention to fonts far more closely than most other people I know. I work with them for a living.
Do you work with Asian languages? I still can't tell if you are upset because the fonts are available or because they aren't. Do you want Apple to just strip all of the language metadata from the fonts so they show up in Apple apps too? Or do you want Apple to start ignoring language metadata in its apps so that Apple apps behave like 3rd party apps? Or do you just want Apple to stop shipping a multi-lingual operating system? So you want macOS to be like Windows where users have to download "language packs" if they speak one of those "weird" languages?
And no, it's far from sudden. Apple has not displayed active fonts correctly since El Capitan, and it's still not fixed. Why not? See my response to MrHoffman.
I just checked in my VMs and I didn't see any difference going back to Mavericks. I don't have 3rd party apps on those VMs to see how they behave. But Apple definitely shipped language-specific fonts in Mavericks. The first font, Al Banyan, is an Arabic font. It doesn't show up in TextEdit by default. I don't see any change in El Capitan.
And I mean incorrectly specifically for Apple's own products. Third party apps are not affected by Apple's own poorly written apps.
You have opinions. I have repeatable, verifiable facts.
I think you've got that reversed.